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# The United States of the Solar System: A.D. 2133 (Book One)

orthodoxymoron

Posts : 7483
Join date : 2010-09-28

Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sun Feb 15, 2015 6:18 pm; edited 5 times in total

Brook

Posts : 3446
Join date : 2010-08-21
Age : 64
I do stupid things at least once a day!  I suppose that makes me ignorant?

A fool on a path:

Conversation over a painted cup of Coffee:

Where's all the paint?  YOU don't need it anymore!

What is unpleasant?

Stable well balanced to...

What is real

Thought/Thoth is real...Physical is the illusion.

Ironic... huh?

We are ALL seeing what we choose to see.

Last edited by Brook on Tue Apr 29, 2014 12:21 pm; edited 8 times in total

orthodoxymoron

Posts : 7483
Join date : 2010-09-28
I have NO Problem with Tough and Intelligent Good-Guys and Good-Gals Networking Publicly and Privately. What if there were a Non-Corrupt and Non-Creepy Version of the Illuminati?? What if the Illuminated-Ones Weren't Naughty?? What if the Agencies Cracked-Down on the Bad-Guys Instead of the Good-Guys?? What if the Master of Masonry Weren't a Tall Grey Alien?? What if Bad Weren't Normal?? Would These be Stupid Things??? I keep suspecting that we're dealing with a corrupted-version of an idealistic-plan. What if it HAD to be that way??!! What if most (or all) or the beings in this solar system (human and otherwise) are worse than we'd wish to admit?? What if most (or all) of us are Fallen-Angels?? What if most (or all) of us are Ex-Greys and/or Ex-Reptilians?? How about Ex-Greys for Jesus??!! What if it has been absolutely necessary for the Corrupt to Rule the Stupid?? What if it's time for all of this madness to be transformed into sanity?? What if it will take 120 years to clean things up?? What if the Sanctuary (This Solar System??) Will be Completely Cleansed, Purified, Restored, and Vindicated by 2133 AD?? What if the Roman Empire will end in 2133 AD?? What if the 2300 Day-Years of Daniel 8:14 really does span from 168 BC to 2133 AD?? What if the Millennium Ends in 2133 AD?? What if the Millennium is essentially a Teutonic-Zionist Phenomenon (which might include Nazi, Mason, and Jesuit components)?? Please remember that I think there are good-guys and bad-guys in ALL Factions. Hitler spoke of a 1,000 year Third-Reich -- but what if we are 880 years into some sort of a Millennial-Reich?? Think of the Great Schism!! Think of the Great Cathedrals!! Think of the Protestant Reformation!! Think of the Pope and the Pope-Emeritus!! What if I had something to do with setting this whole thing up in antiquity?? What if I was supposed to be the Antichrist in modernity?? What if my dismal-life and radical-thread are screwing everything up?? Please remember that I take extraordinary modeling liberties in this thread. This is NOT a scholarly or evangelistic work. It is intended to make you think!! I continue to think that 'Disclosure' will be a 'Nightmare'. A 'Regime-Change' might end-up exchanging one 'Bad-Faction' for another 'Bad-Faction'. But what if a 'Good-Faction' would REALLY screw things up??!! Don't get your hopes up. If my prophetic-speculation is even remotely-correct -- we might be facing a VERY difficult and violent 120 years!! What Would Noah Say?? Once again -- don't expect any surprises from me -- other than continued refinement of my reposting. I have no other plans presently. I honestly don't. What if I shouldn't be too sanctimonious?? What if I shouldn't throw stones?? What if none of us should?? What if it will take a Bad@$$Solar System Administrator to clean things up -- and make things better?? But how do we avoid all of the Revelation-Madness?? Once again, take this study-list seriously -- as a foundation for bigger and better things. I'm not trying to stifle progress. I am attempting to facilitate the right kind of progress. BTW -- Talking to Dr. Timothy Leary About Jesus Was a Real Trip!! Namaste and Godspeed. 1. Patriarchs and Prophets -- Ellen White. 2. Genesis, Deuteronomy, Job, Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, Isaiah, Daniel. (KJV) 3. Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Acts, Romans, Hebrews, Revelation. (KJV) 4. Daniel -- Desmond Ford. (1978) 5. 1928 Book of Common Prayer and Liturgy. 6. Desire of Ages -- Ellen White. 7. Federalist Papers and U.S. Constitution. 8. Astronomy and Law Textbooks. 9. Science-Fiction. 10. Sacred Classical Music. Don't be Frightened. Everyone and Everything are Under Control -- Including YOU. Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Fri Feb 12, 2016 6:43 pm; edited 4 times in total orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 Consider Cathedrals!! I have mixed-feelings about cathedrals. I wouldn't wish for them to be built today -- but I feel they should be properly maintained, understood, and utilized. They are already built -- and I feel they have many lessons to teach us -- good and bad. They are grand and glorious -- yet they are sometimes a bit creepy. I love the sound of music in large churches and cathedrals!! What do you think?? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathedral A cathedral (French cathédrale from Latin. cathedra, "seat" from the Greek kathedra (καθέδρα), seat, bench, from kata "down" + hedra seat, base, chair) is a Christian church which contains the seat of a bishop,[1] thus serving as the central church of a diocese, conference, or episcopate.[2] Although the word "cathedral" is sometimes loosely applied, churches with the function of "cathedral" occur specifically and only in those denominations with an episcopal hierarchy, such as the Roman Catholic, Anglican, Orthodox, and some Lutheran and Methodist churches.[2] In the Greek Orthodox Church, the terms kathedrikos naos (literally: "cathedral shrine") is sometimes used for the church at which an archbishop or "metropolitan" presides. The term "metropolis" (literally "mother city") is used more commonly than "diocese" to signify an area of governance within the church. There are certain variations on the use of the term "cathedral"; for example, some pre-Reformation cathedrals in Scotland now within the Church of Scotland still retain the term cathedral, despite that church's Presbyterian polity that does not have bishops. The same occurs in Germany, where Protestant churches (many with a presbyterian or congregational polity) co-operate under an umbrella organisation, the Evangelical Church in Germany, with some retaining cathedrals or using the term as a merely honorary title and function, void of any hierarchical supremacy. As cathedrals are often particularly impressive edifices, the term "cathedral" is often applied colloquially to any large and impressive church, regardless of whether it functions as a cathedral, such as the Crystal Cathedral in California or figuratively to imply that a church is of outstanding beauty such as St John the Baptist, Tideswell, known as the "Cathedral of the Peak". Several cathedrals in Europe, such as that of Strasbourg, Essen, Freiburg i.B., and in England at York, Lincoln and Southwell, are referred to as "Minster" (German: Münster) churches, from Latin monasterium, because the establishments were served by canons living in community or may have been an abbey, prior to the Reformation. The other kind of great church in Western Europe is the abbey. The word cathedral is derived from the Latin word cathedra ("seat" or "chair"), and refers to the presence of the bishop's or archbishop's chair or throne. In the ancient world, the chair was the symbol of a teacher and thus of the bishop's role as teacher, and also of an official presiding as a magistrate and thus of the bishop's role in governing a diocese. Though now grammatically used as a noun, the term "cathedral" was originally the adjective in the phrase "cathedral church", from the Latin ecclesia cathedralis. The seat marks the place set aside in the prominent church of the diocese for the head of that diocese and is therefore a major symbol of authority.[3] In the canon law of the Catholic Church the relationship of the bishop to his cathedral is often compared to the relationship of a parish priest to the parochial church. Both are pastors over an area (the diocese for the bishop and the parish for the parish priest) and both are rectors over a building (the cathedral for the bishop and the parish church for the pastor). In view of this, canon lawyers often extend the metaphor and speak of the cathedral church as the one church of the diocese, and all others are deemed chapels in their relation to it. Cathedral churches may have different degrees of dignity: 1. A parish church which was formerly a cathedral is known as a "proto-cathedral". 2. A parish church temporarily serving as the cathedral or co-cathedral of a diocese is known as a "pro-cathedral". 3. Two churches jointly serving cathedrals of a diocese are each known as "co-cathedrals". 4. The church of a diocesan bishop is known as a "cathedral". If it is not also a parish church, it is "cathedral peculiar". 5. A church to which other diocesan cathedral churches of a province are suffragan is a "metropolitan cathedral". 6. A church under which are ranged metropolitical churches and their provinces is a "primatial cathedral". 7. A church to which primatial, metropolitical, and cathedral churches alike owe allegiance is a "patriarchal cathedral". The removal of a bishop's cathedra from a church deprives that church of its cathedral dignity, although often the name is retained in popular use, as for example former cathedrals acquired by the Presbyterian Church of Scotland (which lacks episcopal structure). Technically, such churches are proto-cathedrals. The title of "primate" was occasionally conferred on metropolitan bishops of sees of great dignity or importance, such as Rouen, whose cathedral churches remained simply metropolitan. Lyon, where the cathedral church is still known as La Primatiale, and Lund in Sweden, may be cited as instances of churches which were really primatial. Lyon had the archbishops of Sens and Paris and their provincial dioceses subject to it until the French Revolution, and Lund had the archbishop of Uppsala and his province subject to it. As with the title of primate, so also that of "patriarch" has been conferred on sees such as Venice and Lisbon, the cathedral churches of which are patriarchal in name alone. The Basilica di San Giovanni in Laterano, the cathedral church of Rome, is the only one in Western Europe which possesses a patriarchal character among Roman Catholics, since the Pope is the Patriarch of the Latin Rite church. However, in February 2006, Pope Benedict XVI ceased the use of the title "Patriarch of the West". The history of the body of clergy attached to the cathedral church is obscure, and in each case local considerations affected its development, however the main features were more or less common to all. Originally the bishop and cathedral clergy formed a kind of religious community, which, while not in the true sense a monastery, was nevertheless often called a monasterium, the word not having the restricted meaning which it afterwards acquired. In this lies the reason for the apparent anomaly that churches like York Minster and Lincoln Cathedral, which never had any monks attached to them, have inherited the name of minster or monastery. In these early communities the clergy often lived apart in their own dwellings, and were not infrequently married. In the 8th century Chrodegang, Bishop of Metz (743-766), compiled a code of rules for the clergy of the cathedral churches, which, though widely accepted in Germany and other parts of the continent, gained little acceptance in England. According to Chrodegang's rule, the cathedral clergy were to live under a common roof, occupy a common dormitory and submit to the authority of a special officer. The rule of Chrodegang was, in fact, a modification of the Benedictine rule. Gisa, a native of Lorraine, who was bishop of Wells from 1061 to 1088, introduced it into England, and imposed its observance on the clergy of his cathedral church, but it was not followed for long there, or elsewhere in England. During the 10th and 11th centuries, the cathedral clergy became more definitely organised and were divided into two classes. One was that of a monastic establishment of some recognised order of monks, often the Benedictines, while the other class was that of a college of clergy, bound by no vows except those of their ordination, but governed by a code of statutes or canons: hence the name of "canon". In this way arose the distinction between the monastic and secular cathedral churches. Outside of Great Britain, monastic cathedrals are known only at Monreale in Sicily and Downpatrick in Ireland.[4] In the case of monastic cathedral churches, the internal government was that of the religious order to which the chapter belonged and all the members kept perpetual residence. The alternative of this was the cathedral ruled by a secular chapter; the dignities of provost, dean, precentor, chancellor, treasurer, etc., came into being for the regulation and good order of the church and its services, while the non-residence of the canons, rather than their perpetual residence, became the rule, and led to their duties being performed by a body of "vicars", who officiated for them at the services of the church. Prior to the Reformation all cathedrals of Western Europe were of the Roman Catholic Church. In England, much of the structure of the monastic and cathedral system was reconstituted during the English Reformation. Although the cathedrals were retained by the now independent and established Church of England, the monastic cathedral chapters were dissolved by King Henry VIII and, with two exceptions, were refounded by him as chapters of canons with a dean as the head and other clergy as minor canons. In Germany and other parts of Europe, with the spread of the Lutheran Church, some ancient churches, like Nidaros Cathedral, Norway, and Lübeck Cathedral, Germany, became the seats of Protestant bishops, as in England. Many new churches were built which serve the regional administrative function of a cathedral. However, not all churches that function as the seat of a bishop are known as "cathedral", the custom varying from place to place, according to local tradition. Some are simply designated "church", as occurs at Budolfi Church, the Lutheran cathedral of Aalborg in Denmark. In most of Europe, the earliest head of a secular church seems to have been the provost (praepositus, probst, etc.), who was charged not only with the internal regulation of the church and oversight of the members of the chapter and control of the services, but was also the steward or seneschal of the lands and possessions of the church. The latter often mainly engaged his attention, to the neglect of his domestic and ecclesiastical duties, and complaints were soon raised that the provost was too much mixed in worldly affairs, and was too frequently absent from his spiritual duties. This led, in many cases, to the institution of a new officer called the "dean", who had charge of that portion of the provost's duties which related to the internal discipline of the chapter and the services of the church. In some cases, the office of provost was abolished, but in others it was continued: the provost, who was occasionally an archdeacon as well, remaining head of the chapter. This arrangement was most commonly followed in Germany. In England the provost was almost unknown. Bishop Gisa introduced a provost as head of the chapter of Wells Cathedral, but the office was afterwards subordinated to the other dignities and the provost became simply the steward of certain of the prebendal lands. The provost of the collegiate church of Beverley Minster was the most notable instance of such an officer in England, but at Beverley he was an external officer with authority in the government of the church, no stall in the choir and no vote in chapter. In Germany and Scandinavia, and in a few of the cathedral churches in the south of France, the provost was the ordinary head of the cathedral chapter, but the office was not common elsewhere. As regards France, of 136 cathedral churches existing at the Revolution, 38 only, and those either on the borders of Germany or in the extreme south, had a provost as the head of the chapter. In others the provost existed as a subordinate officer. There were two provosts at Autun, and Lyon and Chartres had four each, all as subordinate officers. The normal constitution of the chapter of a secular cathedral church comprised four dignitaries (there might be more), in addition to the canons. These are the dean, the precentor, the chancellor and the treasurer. These four dignitaries, occupying the four corner stalls in the choir, are called in many of the statutes the quatuor majores personae of the church. The role of dean (from decanus) seems to have derived its designation from the Benedictine "dean" who had ten monks under his charge. The role of dean came into existence to supply the place of the provost in the internal management of the church and chapter. In England every secular cathedral church was headed by a dean who was originally elected by the chapter and confirmed in office by the bishop. The dean is president of the chapter, and within the cathedral has charge of the performance of the services, taking specified portions of them by statute on the principal festivals. The dean sits in the chief stall in the choir, which is usually at the west end of the south side. Next to the dean (as a rule) is the precentor (primicerius, cantor, etc.), whose special duty is that of regulating the musical portion of the services. The precentor presides in the dean's absence, and occupies the corresponding stall on the north side, although there are exceptions to this rule, where, as at St Paul's, the archdeacon of the cathedral city ranks second and occupies what is usually the precentor's stall. The third dignitary is the chancellor (scholasticus, écoldtre, capiscol, magistral, etc.), who must not be confounded with the chancellor of the diocese. The chancellor of the cathedral church is charged with the oversight of its schools, ought to read divinity lectures, and superintend the lections in the choir and correct slovenly readers. The chancellor is often the secretary and librarian of the chapter. In the absence of the dean and precentor, the chancellor is president of the chapter, and within the cathedral is usually assigned the easternmost stall, on the dean's side of the choir. The fourth dignitary is the treasurer (custo, sacrisla, cheficier) who is guardian of the fabric, and of all the furniture and ornaments of the church, and whose duty was to provide bread and wine for the Eucharist, and candles and incense. The treasurer also regulated such matters as the ringing of the bells. The treasurer's stall is opposite to that of the chancellor. In many cathedral churches are additional dignitaries, as the praelector, subdean, vice-chancellor, succentor-canonicorum, and others, whose roles came into existence to supply the places of the other absent dignitaries, for non-residence was the fatal blot of the secular churches, and in this they contrasted very badly with the monastic churches, where all the members were in continuous residence. Besides the dignitaries there were the ordinary canons, each of whom, as a rule, held a separate prebend or endowment, besides receiving his share of the common funds of the church. For the most part the canons also speedily became non-resident, and this led to the distinction of residentiary and non-residentiary canons, till in most churches the number of resident canons became definitely limited in number, and the non-residentiary canons, who no longer shared in the common funds, became generally known as prebendaries only, although by their non-residence they did not forfeit their position as canons, and retained their votes in chapter like the others. This system of non-residence led also to the institution of vicars choral, each canon having his own vicar, who sat in his stall in his absence, and when the canon was present, in the stall immediately below, on the second form. The vicars had no place or vote in chapter, and, though irremovable except for offences, were the servants of their absent canons whose stalls they occupied, and whose duties they performed. Outside Britain they were often called demi-prebendaries. As time went on the vicars were themselves often incorporated as a kind of lesser chapter, or college, under the supervision of the dean and chapter. There was no distinction between the monastic cathedral chapters and those of the secular canons, in their relation to the bishop or diocese. In both cases the chapter was the bishop's consilium which he was bound to consult on all important matters and without doing so he could not act. Thus, a judicial decision of a bishop needed the confirmation of the chapter before it could be enforced. He could not change the service books, or "use" of the church or diocese, without capitular consent, and there are episcopal acts, such as the appointment of a diocesan chancellor, or vicar general, which still need confirmation by the chapter, but the older theory of the chapter as the bishop's council in ruling the diocese has become a thing of the past, in Europe. In its corporate capacity the chapter takes charge sede vacante of a diocese. In England, however (except as regards Salisbury and Durham),[5] this custom has never obtained, the two archbishops having, from time immemorial, taken charge of the vacant dioceses in their respective provinces. When, however, either of the sees of Canterbury or York is vacant the chapters of those churches take charge, not only of the diocese, but of the province as well, and incidentally, therefore, of any of the dioceses of the province which may be vacant at the same time. The role of the cathedral is chiefly to serve God in the community, through its hierarchical and organisational position in the church structure. The building itself, by its physical presence, symbolises both the glory of God and of the church. A cathedral, its bishop and dignitaries have traditional functions which are mostly religious in nature, but may also be closely associated with the civil and communal life of the city and region. The cathedral is frequently the most imposing building, and one of the most ancient buildings in its town. The great size and splendor of the cathedral may be out of all proportion to the town itself. The money and talents expended on the building are seen as honoring God, and may also demonstrate both the devotion and the status of the patrons. Cathedrals are very often oriented east/west, so that the worshipers look towards the rising sun, symbolizing the Risen Christ. The architectural form of the building most frequently has the ground plan of a cross. This form is both functional and symbolic, its symbolism referring to the cross on which Jesus was crucified. The form is liturgically functional as it allows the building to be divided into sections where different activities take place, or that are occupied by different people, such as the clergy, the choir and the laity. The main body of the building, making the longer arm of the cross, is called the nave, and is where worshipers congregate; the term is from the Latin word for ship. The cathedral is symbolically a ship bearing the people of God through the storms of life.[6] The nave is also used for major processions, which gather or enter at the furthest door (liturgically generally called the West Door). The aisles on each side of the nave facilitate the movement of people within the building, without disrupting worshipers in the central space. The arms of the cross are called the transepts and often contain a number of chapels. Farthest from the main entry is the sanctuary where the Blessed Sacrament is laid on the altar or communion table for the consecration. "Sanctuary" means "Holy Place". The word has passed into modern English with an altered meaning because traditionally a criminal who could gain access to this area without capture was thereby given the sanctuary of the church. Cathedral buildings of the Western European tradition symbolize the progression of the Christian soul towards Salvation. Many cathedrals of Eastern European tradition are centrally planned. These churches are almost always domed. The symbolism in these cathedral structures is of the hierarchy of Earth and Heaven, and often reveals its meaning through the internal decoration of the building with frescoes or mosaics. Apart from its organisational function as the seat of the bishop, and the meeting place for the chapter of the diocese, the cathedral has a liturgical function in offering daily church services. Most cathedrals have at least three services of worship every day, often taking the form of matins, Holy Communion and an evening service which is often sung by the precentor and choir. There are often additional services on Sunday. Cathedrals generally have an area dedicated to the performance of choral services and with seating specifically for the choir and dignitories of the church and town. This part of the building is called the Choir or Quire, and is generally located between the sanctuary and the nave. Because music often plays an important part in the performance of the liturgy, cathedrals generally have a pipe organ to accompany the choir. Cathedrals always have a font or water basin at which the rite of Baptism is performed, in which a person is formally accepted into the Christian church. The font is often placed towards the door because the Baptism signifies entry into the community of the church. In some cathedrals, most particularly in Italy, the rite of Baptism is performed in a separate building. One of the functions of the cathedral is the reading and expounding upon the Holy Scripture. The cathedral generally has a lectern from which the scripture is read. This often takes the form of an eagle of brass or carved wood which supports the book on its outstretched wings and is the symbol of John the Evangelist. However, some cathedrals retain elaborate medieval structures on either side of the church, one for the reading of the Gospel and the other for the reading of the Epistle. The function of expounding on the scriptures is traditionally performed from the pulpit which is generally constructed in such a way that the voice of the preacher is projected out to the congregation. The pulpit is often decorated with the winged figures of a man, a lion, a bull and an eagle, representing the Gospel writers, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John.[7] The services that are held within the cathedral follow an annual cycle. The designated scriptural readings for each day of the church's year establish a pattern which alternates periods of introspection and penitence with periods of celebration, and is punctuated by the two great celebrations of Christmas and Easter. Many cathedrals are places of pilgrimage to which people travel in order to worship or venerate a holy object or the reliquary of a saint. Many cathedrals are regarded as places that have provided rewarding religious experiences, where prayers have been answered or miracles have taken place. Pilgrimage was particularly popular in the late medieval period. Some cathedrals such as Santiago de Compostela continue to attract pilgrims. The formal cathedral services are linked to the cycle of the year and respond to the seasons of the Northern Hemisphere, Christmas falling in the winter and Easter in the spring. Cathedrals often hold a service of thanksgiving called Harvest Festival in the autumn. Births, marriages and deaths are often celebrated by services at cathedrals and the cathedral often acts as a repository of local history by recording these events. The cathedral marks times of national and local civic celebration and sadness with special services. The funerals of those famous within the community are invariably held at cathedrals. People who have served the community or the church are often buried within the cathedral with which they are associated. Alternatively, they may be commemorated by a memorial. Some cathedrals, such as Aachen and Rheims are the traditional coronation places of monarchs. Another civic function of the cathedral is the imparting of significant civil information. Announcements may be to the populace from the steps of the cathedral, or within the cathedral itself. Most cathedrals have a bell or bells. These are used to announce that a service is soon to take place. They are also used to convey information and celebration. The ringing of peals signifies a time of rejoicing, such as a wedding. An extended ringing of peals or "changes" conveys a time of great civic celebration. The slow tolling of the deepest bell signifies a death or disaster. Many cathedrals have a clock with associated chimes which announce the time. The bells of a cathedral are traditionally used to signal the outbreak and the ending of war. Cathedrals are often associated with significant secular organisations such as the office of the local mayor and council, the local court, the local regiment, schools, sporting organisations and service clubs. The cathedral often has its own school, primarily for the education of choristers, but often including other children as well. The cathedral, often being a large building, serves as a meeting place for many people. The cathedral often forms a centre of different activities related to community service, youth activities, study, music and decorative arts. Cathedral buildings, especially those dating from the Medieval period, are frequently the grandest of churches in the diocese (and country). The ancient cathedrals of England, of Northern France, Belgium, Spain, Portugal, Germany and Sicily, the Baroque cathedrals of South America, and many individual cathedrals from Italy and other parts of Europe, are among the largest and finest religious buildings. Many are renowned for their architecture or their decorative features such as sculpture, stained glass and frescos. While cathedral buildings, in general, tend to be large, size and grandeur have rarely been essential requirements. Early Celtic and Saxon cathedrals tended to be of diminutive size, as is the Byzantine so-called Little Metropole Cathedral of Athens. In Italy, with a few notable exceptions such as Florence Cathedral and Milan Cathedral, cathedrals are numerous and are often similar in form and size to monastic or large parish churches. In modern times, where functionality is the foremost consideration, a cathedral church may be a modest structure. Cathedrals of monastic foundation, and some of secular clergy have cloisters which traditionally provided an open area where secular activities took place protected from wind and rain. Some cathedrals also have a chapter house where the chapter could meet. In England, where these buildings have survived, they are often octagonal. A cathedral may front onto the main square of a town, as in Florence, or it may be set in a walled close as at Canterbury. There may be a number of associated monastic or clergy buildings, a bishop's palace and often a school to educate the choristers. Many cathedral buildings are very famous for their architecture and have local and national significance, both artistically and historically. Many are listed among the UNESCO World Heritage Sites. Many cathedrals, because of their large size and the fact that they often have towers, spires or domes, have until the 20th century, been the major landmarks in cities or in views across the countryside. With highrise building, civil action has been taken in some cases, such as the Cologne Cathedral to prevent the vista of the cathedral from being spoiled. Because many cathedrals took centuries to build and decorate, they constitute a major artistic investment for the city in which they stand. Not only may the building itself be architecturally significant, but the church often houses treasures such as stained glass, stone and wood statues, historic tombs, richly carved furniture and objects of both artistic and religious significance such as reliquaries. Moreover, the cathedral often plays a major role in telling the story of the town, through its plaques, inscriptions, tombs, stained glass and paintings. For these reasons, tourists have travelled to cathedrals for hundreds of years. Many cathedrals cater for tourists by charging a fee to any visitors outside service times or requesting a donation or making a charge to take photos. Cathedrals which are particularly popular tourist venues sometimes provide guides, leaflets, souvenirs and cafes. References 1. Shorter Oxford English Dictionary, ISBN 0-19-860575-7 2. New Standard Encyclopedia, 1992 by Standard Educational Corporation, Chicago, Illinois; page B-262c 3. New Standard Encyclopedia, 1992 by Standard Educational Corporation, Chicago, Illinois; page C-172/3 4. Edwards, Kathleen (1967). The English Secular Cathedrals of the Middle Ages (2nd ed.). Manchester University Press. p. 10. 5. Till, Barry (1993). York Against Durham: The Guardianship of the Spiritualities in the Diocese of Durham Sede Vacante. York: Borthwick Institute Publications. p. 31. ISBN 0903857421. 6. W. H. Auden, "Cathedrals, Luxury liners laden with souls, Holding to the East their hulls of stone" 7. T. Francis Bumpus, The Cathedrals and Churches of Belgium. Sources Carl F. Barnes, Jr. "Cathedral". In: Joseph Strayer, ed. Dictionary of the Middle Ages. New York: Scribner’s, 1938. Vol. III. pp. 191–92. Richard Utz. "The Medieval Cathedral: From Spiritual Site to National Super-Signifier". The Year's Work in Medievalism 15 (2001), 127–31. André Vauchez. "La cathédrale". In: Pierre Nora, ed. Les Lieux de Mémoire. Paris: Gallimard, 1997. Vol. III. pp. 3122–34. Further reading Johnson, Paul. British Cathedrals. London: Weidenfeld & Nicolson, 1980. ISBN 0-297-77828-5. Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Fri Feb 12, 2016 6:45 pm; edited 2 times in total orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 bobhardee wrote:Alfred Lambremont Weber 4-27-14… “Nikola Tesla re-started Earth’s Exopolitical communications with an intelligent civilization on Mars in 1901″ Posted on 2014/04/29 by kauilapele Click to enlarge IMAGE A – NY Times, Jan. 16, 1901 – 70 minute light flash from Mars inspired Tesla to initiate communications with intelligent Martian civilization This is quite an extensively researched article Alfred put out 2 days ago.. I’ve not read the full article yet, but it sure appears interesting. And a key insight into when the more modern extraterrestrial communications began (and perhaps yet one more read=son why Tesla (and others) were compromised and/or silenced). ————————————————————————— mars_is_peopled_want_kirks_soap IMAGE B – 1893 Kirk’s Soap Ad, capitalizing on popular interest in intelligent life on Mars and showing the openness of Life on Mars reality in American life prior to the paranoia following the 1952 US Capitol UFO flyover and the 1953 CIA’s Durant Report/Robertson Panel Nikola Tesla restarted Earth’s Exopolitical communications with an intelligent civilization on Mars in 1901 by Alfred Lambremont Webre [4-27-14] VANCOUVER, BC – There is substantial documentation of Nikola Tesla’s role as an early pioneer in re-establishing in 1901 public exopolitical communications between our Earthling human civilization and an intelligent civilization on Mars, most probably our human cousins known as homo martis terris. Public Earth-Mars exopolitical communications had most probably been severed since the solar system catastrophe of 9500 BC that greatly damaged Mars atmosphere and its surface ecology, and destroyed Earth’s great maritime civilization. Nikola Tesla’s early work in re-establishing interactive communication with an intelligent Martian laid the foundation for the U.S. government’s secret DARPA time travel and teleportation program 1968-73 that employed Tesla-based technologies, and ironically perhaps for the secret CIA Mars “jump room” program that was initiated in the early 1980s that reportedly employed grey extraterrestrial technologies. Jan. 1901 Shaft of Light from Mars On January 16, 1901 the New York Times (See Image A) reported Harvard’s Lowell Observatory as recording a 70 minute shaft of light from Mars that seemed inteligently directed. Taking this as an intentional communication from the civilization on Mars, Nikola Tesla intensified his efforts at achieving interactive communication with the intelligence behind the signal. NASA’s Mars page reports how “Nikola Tesla (1856-1943), a brilliant Serbian-American inventor and scientist, is building a wireless system to communicate with Martians. (N. Tesla, “Talking with the planets”, Collier’s Weekly, Vol 24, 4-5, 1901).” Tesla researcher Frank Germano writes, “A report by W. Pickering, professor of the Harvard Observatory, named “Alternating light from Mars”, was published in ‘New York Times’ on January 16, 1901 [Image A]. It may be shortened: “‘Last year in the beginning of December we got a telegram from Lowell observatory at Arizona. This telegram informed that a strong light flux was noticed coming from Mars and lasted for 70 minutes. Lowell observatory specializes on observations of Mars, and observer was an attentive, approved and experienced man, so we have no doubt in his statements. We will consider these facts immediately and will notify Europe and America via telegraph. The light came from the known point on Mars and there is no unusual in this point according to scientific data. Whatever there was, now we have no means to research anything. We cannot say with certainty if it is a sign that there is an intellect. For the time present this phenomenon is inexplicable.’ “When this information appeared, Tesla was in New York. He just returned from Colorado Springs, where he, through the course of year, made epochal and inexplicable experiments with electromagnetic fields of resonant properties. (Tesla’s laboratory in Colorado was situated precisely on the summit of Pike’s Peak. It is interesting that this peak was deified by the Hopi Indians- they consider it the Spiritual Pole of the World). “Encouraged by the information from Lowell observatory, Tesla stated in the New York Gazette that during his research in Colorado Springs, he communicated with Mars himself. At that time, he made hints about having already designed a device for interplanetary communication, which would be improved in the near future. He wrote: “I’ll never forget the first feeling that I felt when I understood that I have a contact with something, which will have priceless and immense results for all humankind. Thing that I noticed, frightened me as if I saw something mysterious and almost preternatural. Little by little I understood that I am the first who hear messages sending from one planet to another…” “Respected Professor Holden didn’t consider Tesla’s contacts with extraterrestrial beings by means of electromagnetism, because he thought it was not a serious case. Tesla worked with some extremely long electromagnetic waves of very high frequency that do not correspond to accepted theory, because increasing of a wave’s frequency is always related with short-wave transmission. However, Tesla’s waves were different from those discovered by Hertz. They propagated with a speed, which far exceeded the speed of light, better to say that their propagation was instantaneous. Tesla had his own theory of electromagnetism, which is still not properly interpreted. He discovered not only the possibility of wireless transmission of energy through the Earth and atmosphere without any losses, but also proved an unprecedented “breakdown power” of these waves during their negotiation of space. There is an unconfirmed legend that Tesla was the first to send periodical signals to the stars. “Supposedly, Tesla sent coded geometrical theorems like those of Tales, Pythagoras, and an Archimedean formula of the harmonic series (we speak about addition of the series 1+1/2+1/4+1/8+…. the Sum of this series is equal to two but, the number of terms can be infinite). Three days later, Tesla was surprised – he got a response. He guessed the principle, which lie in the basis of the response code, and got a human face with regular features. At first he couldn’t understand if this picture was made by those who sent this signal and wanted to show that they know of our civilization, or they drew their own image to demonstrate that there are similar beings in Cosmos. If it is true, then it should be clear that Tesla refused any open discussion of this discovery because he couldn’t get a response. But soon, something occurred that returned discussion of this happening in the American press. “In 1902, Lord Kelvin, a famous English physicist, visited America. When he spoke to Tesla, he expressed a full consent and understanding of the fact that details of Tesla’s ‘extraterrestrial communication’ were not for public discussion. After a banquet (organized in his honor), Lord Kelvin said some good words about New York: ‘It is the city with the best illumination in the world and it is the only place on the Earth, which can be seen from Mars’. In addition, as if in some kind of inspiration he finally exclaimed ‘Mars is signaling New York’. This time, nobody had objections. Even persistent Professor Holden kept silent. It was not polite to contradict such an old and respected man as Lord Kelvin. Instead of objections, an article written by the writer and publicist Julian Hotorn, Tesla’s associate, appeared as a direct conclusion from this discussion. He described Tesla’s sensational methods as a fantasy. Hotorn wrote: “‘It is evident that people from Mars and other old planets had been visiting Earth for years and attentively observe the development of our civilization. Besides, Tesla’s birth changed all. Maybe, it is possible that people from the stars control his spiritual and scientific development, isn’t it? Is there anybody who can know something concrete?’ In the heat of the disputes concerning Martians, Tesla was alone in his Wardenclyffe Tower and continued to work hard and insensibly on the biggest project of his life; Wardenclyffe Tower was to make radical changes in the development of our civilization. These changes cannot easily be considered true.” Communicating with Mars: The Experiments of Tesla & Hodowanec In “Communicating with Mars: The Experiments of Tesla & Hodowanec,” in the Journal of Borderland Research, Robert A. Nelson writes, While Nikola Tesla was conducting experiments with his Magnifying Transmitter at Colorado Springs in 1899, he detected coherent signals which he determined had originated on Mars. Tesla was widely criticized for his astounding claims, yet no one could seriously dispute him; he was a solo pioneer without peer. No one since then has reported constructing a Magnifying Transmitter or otherwise replicated his experiments; the issue remains unresolved and the mystery unsolved. Tesla revealed no technical details in his pronouncements and publications of that period (other than the pertinent patents). His Colorado Notebooks were published in the 1980s, but they make no mention of his alleged contact with Mars. Tesla elaborated on the subject of “Talking With the Planets” in Collier’s Weekly (March 1901): “As I was improving my machines for the production of intense electrical actions, I was also perfecting the means for observing feeble efforts. One of the most interesting results, and also one of great practical importance, was the development of certain contrivances for indicating at a distance of many hundred miles an approaching storm, its direction, speed and distance traveled…. “It was in carrying on this work that for the first time I discovered those mysterious effects which have elicited such unusual interest. I had perfected the apparatus referred to so far that from my laboratory in the Colorado mountains I could feel the pulse of the globe, as it were, noting every electrical change that occurred within a radius of eleven hundred miles. “I can never forget the first sensations I experienced when it dawned upon me that I had observed something possibly of incalculable consequences to mankind. I felt as though I were present at the birth of a new knowledge or the revelation of a great truth…. My first observations positively terrified me, as there was present in them something mysterious, not to say supernatural, and I was alone in my laboratory at night; but at that time the idea of these disturbances being intelligently controlled signals did not yet present itself to me. The changes I noted were taking place periodically and with such a clear suggestion of number and order that they were not traceable to any cause known to me. I was familiar, of course, with such electrical disturbances as are produced by the sun, Aurora Borealis, and earth currents, and I was as sure as I could be of any fact that these variations were due to none of these causes. The nature of my experiments precluded the possibility of the changes being produced by atmospheric disturbances, as has been rashly asserted by some. It was sometime afterward when the thought flashed upon my mind that the disturbances I had observed might be due to an intelligent control. Although I could not decipher their meaning, it was impossible for me to think of them as having been entirely accidental. The feeling is constantly growing on me that I had been the first to hear the greeting of one planet to another. A purpose was behind these electrical signals….” Decades later on his birthday in 1937, he announced: “I have devoted much of my time during the year past to the perfecting of a new small and compact apparatus by which energy in considerable amounts can now be flashed through interstellar space to any distance without the slightest dispersion.” (New York Times, Sunday, 11 July 1937.) Tesla never publicly revealed any technical details of his improved transmitter, but in his 1937 announcement, he revealed a new formula showing that “The kinetic and potential energy of a body is the result of motion and determined by the product of its mass and the square of its velocity. Let the mass be reduced, the energy is reduced by the same proportion. If it be reduced to zero, the energy is likewise zero for any finite velocity.” (New York Sun, 12 July 1937, p. 6.) About 40 years later, Arthur Mathews claimed that Tesla had secretly developed the “Teslascope” for the purpose of communicating with Mars. The late Dr. Andrija Puharich met with Matthews, and discussed him in an interview (Pyramid Guide, May-June & July-Aug. 1978): “[Arthur Matthews] came from England. Matthews’ father was a laboratory assistant to the noted physicist Lord Kelvin back in the 1890s. Tesla came over to England to meet Kelvin… to convince him that Alternating Current was more efficient than Direct Current. Kelvin at that time opposed the AC movement…. In 1902, the Matthews family left England and immigrated to Canada…. When Matthews was 16 his father arranged for him to apprentice under Tesla…. He eventually worked for him and continued this alliance until Tesla’s death in 1943…. “It’s not generally known, but Tesla actually had two huge magnifying transmitters built in Canada, and Matthews operated one of them…. People mostly know about the Colorado Springs transmitters and the unfinished one on Long Island. I saw the two Canadian transmitters. All the evidence is there…. “[The Teslascope is] the thing Tesla invented to communicate with Beings on other planets. There’s a diagram of the Teslascope in Matthew’s book [The Wall of Light]. In principle, it takes in cosmic ray signals…. Eventually the signals are stepped down to audio…. Speak into one end, and the signal goes out the other end as a cosmic ray emitter….” Matthews’ diagrams of the Teslascope make minimal electronic sense. No one has ever confirmed the reality of the Teslascope. Several years after Tesla announced his reception of signals from Mars, Guglielmo Marconi also claimed to have heard from an alien radio transmitter. However, Marconi was more easily dismissed by his contemporaries, who claimed that Marconi had received interference from another radio station on Earth. In the 1970s, L.G. Lawrence (field manager of the Ecola Institute) described his “Communication by Accident” with ET intelligences: “On October 29, 1971… while conducting exploratory RBS [Remote Biological Sensing] experiments in Riverside County, CA, our field instrumentation’s organic transducer complex intercepted a train of apparently intelligent communication signals (tight spacing and discrete pulse intervals) while accidentally allowed to remain pointed at the constellation Ursa Major during a short rest period. The phenomenon prevailed for somewhat over 33 minutes…. “A somewhat similar phenomenon was observed on April 10, 1972…. The apparent signals, aside from seemingly growing weaker, appear to be transmitted at great intervals ranging from weeks to months, possibly years. A faint, coherent , binary-type phenomenon was noted during aural monitoring…. Intervals between rapid series of pulse trains ranged from… 3 to 10 minutes…. “Because our equipment is impervious to electromagnetic radiation and found free of internal anomalies, the tentative conclusion of biological-type interstellar communications signals has emerged…. “As a mere audio presentation, the instrumentation tape is unpleasant to listen to. However, a fascinating degree of enchantment tends to emerge after the tape has been played back three or more times, typically over a period of weeks. We ascribe this to psycho-acoustical adaptation…. The tape contains a short, incremental series of deep, harmonious oscillations resembling nonsense chatter or background modulations. An intelligent character of the overall pulse is applied by discrete spacing patterns, apparent repetitions of sequences, and highly attenuated Gaussian noise…” (Borderlands, 1st Qtr., 1996, pp. 27-29). Gregory Hodowanec In the 1980s, electrical engineer Greg Hodowanec developed his theory of Rhysmonic Cosmology. He also experimented with a Gravity Wave Detector (GWD) of his own design. The simple devices detect “coherent modulations” in the microwave radiation. Hodowanec published his first report of “SETI with Gravitational Signals” using his GWDs (Radio Astronomy, April 1986): “The advantage of a possible gravitational technique for SETI over the radio technique is primarily one of time of ‘propagation’ for these signals. The radio waves travel at the speed of light, but the gravitational signals (per the writer’s theories) are essentially instantaneous signals. Another advantage of the gravitational technique is the simplicity of the instrumentation required. As SARA members know, radio astronomy can be quite complicated. The gravitational wave detectors… must rely largely on the Earth’s mass as a ‘shadow’ to enable the detection of gravitational radiation. Therefore, ‘objects’ or signals located in the observers’ zenith are best detected. Yet, the other areas are still ‘detectable’ especially with the aid of other ‘shadows’ such as the sun, moon, planets, etc. “Of particular interest to SETI observers may be the strange audio type gravitational signals which appear to come from the Auriga and Perseus region of our Galaxy. These ‘signals’ have been ‘heard’ by the writer for several years now, and generally range between about 4 and 5 hours right ascension, with a peak intensity near 4.5 hours R.A. The signals appear to be several ‘tones’….” Soon afterward, Hodowanec made the first mention of a definite contact with an apparently extraterrestrial communicator in a letter (7-23-88) to an editor at Radio-Electronics magazine: “On the morning of this date, at 7:30 to 7:38 AM (EST), I recorded the following apparently Morse-Code like pulses: “A A A A R A R T T N N N N K C N N N E E E E E N E N N T T T N E E E E E A E E R K E N N E T E E A A A A E E E N T T K N T N T S E S E S E S E M N A S E S E S E S E S E S E S E S E S E — “As you can see, these do not appear to be just random pulses, but the SE signals, which are most prevalent, appear to be possibly an identification signal. These signals are detected in shielded l/f detectors and thus are scalar (gravitational) in nature. The signals above (if they were extraterrestrial) came from either the Auriga-Perseus region near my zenith or the Bootes region under my Earth position. I still cannot rule out that they may just be due to Earth core movements of some sort which are remarkably like Morse code signals, or even the possibility that they are man-made.” By July 1988, Hodowanec had confirmed Tesla’s claims, as he announced in “Some Remarks on Tesla’s Mars Signals”: “…Such signals are being received today with simple modern-day scalar-type signal detectors… coherent modulations are being ‘heard’ in [the microwave] background radiation. The most prominent modulations being three pulses (code S) slightly separated in time, a la Tesla! On occasions, the code equivalents of an E, N, A, or K, are also heard, but the most persistent response is SE, SE, etc. “Any l/f type noise detector will respond to this background modulation. However, the experimenter must be careful that he is not creating these responses at the ‘local’ level by his own or other local actions. For example, the detectors will also respond to heart beats, breathing actions, local movements, as well as possible psychic effects. The detectors are easy to make and the experimenter should easily reproduce these results.” Hodowanec released more details in a Cosmology Data Note (10-13-88): “Since about early August 1988, it was noticed that apparently ‘intelligent signals’ existed in these modulations [of the microwave background radiation]. It can be said that the intelligence was in the form of digital-type communication, e.g., dots and dashes, or ones and zeros. This type of communication may have been chosen by this ‘unknown communicator’ as it was conducive to the ‘mass movement’ form of longitudinal gravity signaling, as well as an easily recognizable universal system. This same method was proposed by the writer for a gravity system communication method. “These ‘signals’ were noticed to be similar to the simpler International Morse Code symbols, primarily because they are the simplest way to present information in the pulse form. Thus, the ‘letters’ found in these transmissions are typically: E, I, T, M, A, N, R, K, S and O, as well as… the comma and the wait signal. However, numbers are seen here as the simple series of pulses, e.g., 1 is one pulse, 2 is two pulses, 3 is three pulses, and so on. “On August 26, 1988, after the writer had sent the message ‘Greg Radio’ during a local gravity signal transmission test, it was noticed that the letters G and D were apparently added to some of the received messages noted thereafter! “The writer’s first hard evidence that the above test message may have been intercepted by this unknown communicator was seen that on August 28, 1988… a strong and repeated message of the Greg Radio was received with the message finally terminated with the series SE (or 31)! “Further evidence that these may be actually communication attempts is seen in that on October 11, 1988… a very different approach was seen: A series of Greg Radio’s was sent at about the normal code speed of about 5 words per minute, followed by KKTT, and then the series was repeated at a slower speed and also followed by KKTT… “Another confirmation that these may be ‘messages’ appeared on October 12, 1988… Here, a series of A’s and R’s (with Greg Radio occasionally inserted) was then followed by Greg Radio sent as a series of five repetitions of each letter, e.g., Greg was sent as GGGGGRRRRREEEEEGGGGG !!! “Sufficient ‘messages have now been received to indicate that perhaps a serious attempt to indicate that perhaps a serious attempt to contact this writer was being made by some ‘unknown communicator’. While this communicator may yet be some terrestrial experimenter, the possibility still exists that the communicator may be ‘extraterrestrial’ for the following reasons: “a. The messages are in simple code (e.g., dits and dahs) type of pulses which would be expected to be used if one intelligent civilization were to try to contact another civilization in terms of pulses. That some of the simplest pulse signals are similar to simple Morse Code signals is more than coincidence — they are both based upon the same premises! “b. Numbers are not in the complicated Morse Code symbols, but are in simple sequence, using short pulses or dits. “c. The ‘communicator’ has recognized the coherent nature of Greg Radio and is possibly using that sequence of codes in various fashions to indicate that a ‘contact’ has been made. “d. The communicator thus far has not responded to ‘word’ messages or the amateur Q-code signals. Thus it is believed that while some apparently Morse Code signals are being used, the communicator is not really familiar with such usage, other than recognizing the coherent nature of the signals. “e. Since these messages at present appear largely near the noon hour, they may be coming from a definite source in space. At present, it is believed to be from the general direction of the constellation, Andromeda, but not necessarily the Galaxy there… “There is also some possibility that this communicator may be ‘extraterrestrial’, perhaps yet in our Solar System (Mars?), but no further than our own Galaxy or Local Group of Galaxies… [T]his same communicator may have been trying to reach here ever since the turn of the century when Nikola Tesla reported the interception of scalar S signals!!” Soon after, Hodowanec wrote this brief, untitled report (2-23-89): “Without going into the details of how this was determined: ET may be on Mars! “This, in spite of NASA’s denial of any life forms on Mars [which situation changed in 1996]. This possibility has been recently suspected by the writer due to the apparently very close tracking of my position on Earth by ET. ET, of course, always knew that I was on Earth (as seen by his tracking), but now he has most emphatically confirmed that he is on the 4th planet from the sun, i.e., Mars!!!!! “While this release is probably a bit premature, I am so positive of these gravity signal ‘exchanges’ that I will stick my neck out in this instance. ET on Mars is apparently much more advanced than we are here on Earth, and he may have even previously visited here on Earth, and possibly colonized here (but who are his possible descendants??). “It is still a mystery on where ET may be living on Mars (possibly underground near the polar regions??), and why ET doesn’t use EM wave signaling methods?? Perhaps, it is because Mars is so hostile now that ET must have developed a very sophisticated underground civilization which is not conducive to EM radiation systems? “This material is being released now confidentially to but a very few active colleagues until further confirmations on this assertion are obtained….” In his Mars Flash #1 (3-28-89) and #2 (3-30-89), Hodowanec notified colleagues that, “As the result of the continued gravity signal communications between GH Labs and the Martians, the following extraordinary facts have come to light: “The exchanges are now being made in terms of short ‘English’ code words for certain items. For example, the Martians now understand that FACE means the human face, MAN means the human person, Earth now means our planet, and Mars means their planet! They had originally tried some of their terminology with me, but gave up except where it made sense to me. For example, I now know that TTT at the end of their names means person and OOTTAEERR is their name for the 10th planet!” In a handwritten footnote to the above, Hodowanec informed this writer that the Martian’s name is “AAAAAATTT”: “He appears to ‘understand’ my messages, even though I may have to repeat them in several ways so that he can ‘see’ the meaning…. “Communications between GH Labs and a Martian intelligence now continue with increasing progress since we have been able to establish over 50 simple expressions (most in simple English) for many of the common ‘ideas’ that we have. Martian AAAAAATTT is extremely adept in relating my English terminology to these common Earth-Mars observations…. “Mars has also confirmed that they are also ‘men’ with one ‘head’ that have two ‘eyes’ that ‘see’. Also, they have one ‘body’ with two arms that have hands with five fingers each. Also they have two legs with two feet that have five toes each. I haven’t been able to have them confirm the nose and mouth in the face, but that could be confirmed shortly, since those features appear in the FACE. “Probably the most significant fact which was determined on this date seems to be that Mars is most emphatic that Earth men are like Mars men! This appears more and more that Mars has colonized Earth in the remote past! This could be true since we on Earth have never really found the ‘missing link’ between Earth humanoids and humans! In a letter (3-17-89) to this writer, Hodowanec mentioned that “Generally, our contacts are limited to 20-30 minutes… since there appear to be other ETs out there interested in joining in also, and so there is some interference after a while. Some of these other ETs use other methods of communications such as tones and what appear to be guttural voices! “ET is probably more advanced then we are on Earth. We no longer exchange simple arithmetic, and when I sent him Pi to five decimal places, he sent Pi back to seven decimal places immediately! We had discussed our nine planet solar system, but ET came back with ten planets, calling the 10th planet OOTTAEERR! When questioned on this, ET kept on confirming the existence of a tenth planet! He now knows the other nine planets by their Earth names! He also confirmed that Mars has two moons, the Earth one, and that Jupiter has nine major moons. “These contacts are getting to be more interesting all the time, and ET appears to be most anxious to continue them. However, I just cannot spend too much time with him… I got across to him that I am just one person here communicating with him, and that the rest of Earth presently does not recognize the existence of any life on Mars…. “I have now had over 100 contacts with ET and can reach him at any time of day or night…. We have also established some simple codes for acknowledgments and go ahead and respond. While we use these simple codes in many contexts, both ET and I now understand in which context they are being used!” In another letter (3-22-89) to colleagues, Hodowanec affirmed that his contacts with Martian intelligents “has been verified in a number of ways… The Martians are apparently the advanced civilization, for they are the ones generating the ‘modulated oscillated beam’ which is now tracking my location on earth and is thus the means of our communications. [The beam is "only about 15 miles in diameter here on Earth, but 1012 inches on Mars."] There is an apparent ‘team’ on Mars which is involved in these contacts. The original contact, ET#1, with whom I have established the initial relationship, is apparently the most highly knowledgeable and advanced. The others who sometimes ‘man’ the Mars station appear to be less knowledgeable and some only request or acknowledge a transmission…. Mars is most desperate to continue these contacts…. [The] exchanges are made in many varied ways which cannot be readily predicted in order to convey the fact that these are real contacts! Also, one can recognize the ‘fist’ of the one ‘keying’ these codes, e.g., ET#1 always sends clean letters or numbers, and identified himself and me in some fashion. The other ETs on Mars usually don’t. Therefore, no automation is being used here! “While these contacts were originally due to a serendipitous circumstances, it is really the result if my gravitational communication experiments and thus a direct result from Rhysmonic Cosmology. And yet, however fantastic and unreal this may seem, it is real, and if also it is confirmed by one of you, it will be a major milestone in the history of mankind! Perhaps, if one of you finally ‘hears’ the modulations of l/f noise background, you may try to establish your own contacts?” However, Gregory Hodowanec also had extreme reservations about the gravity of the situation, which he expressed it in a letter (4-14-89) to this writer: “…my ‘contacts’ with Mars continue with much information being exchanged. However, due to the increasingly astounding nature of these exchanges, I am now limiting further releases to only two long-time observers (witnesses) of my research efforts. This is being done so as not to jeopardize these contacts with unwanted notoriety or publicity in the media. There are now nine “Mars Flashes” for the record. Perhaps, in the future, I may release some of these…. “…gravity signal communications are instantaneous, require extremely small energy expenditure, [unlike Tesla’s experiments] and is so simple as to be just unbelievable by the average person. However, this is as far as I want to go with release of details at this time…. “I would appreciate that you keep this info somewhat confidential now. The Earth may not be ready for what I will have to say eventually. Nothing dire, just fantastic and thus perhaps unbelievable!” A variety of GWD circuits exist today (Figure 2). Complete details of Gregory Hodowanec’s theory Rhysmonic Cosmology, etc., are available from Rex Research. For more information, please consult: Articles on Tesla-based ( and other) time travel & teleportation http://bit.ly/1fmPBcD Resources on Secret Mars Program and Life on Mars http://bit.ly/1g7ywC6 orthodoxymoron wrote:Another great post, Bob! I think Tesla is highly significant. What if Tesla was from Mars (on a soul-basis, at least)?! I've really hit a brick-wall with this stuff -- and I think I need to do something else. I just finished watching On Any Sunday (an old motorcycle movie) for probably the 20th time!! I'm going to be doing more of that sort of thing in the coming days, months, and years. Why try to be on the cutting-edge of the madness?? What's the point?? I knew a lot of crazy-stuff decades ago, but I avoided getting too involved in forbidden subjects. I figured that top-people were responsibly dealing with top-secret situations. But 9-11, 60 Minutes, Crazy-Wars, Crazy-Leaders, etc. and et al -- made me rethink avoiding the madness. The internet-madness forced me to become more involved. I thought it completely irresponsible to just look the other way. But now I think I've gone too far -- and I think too many people are learning too much -- so why fan the flames of a very volatile situation?? I guess I'm seeking peace, prosperity, and resolution!! "Peace! Peace! But There is No Peace!" What Would Curious George Say?? What Would the Phobos Martians Say?? What Would the Saint Louis Jesuits Say?? Don't be frightened. I mean no harm. I remain a completely ignorant fool. I just wish to reiterate that I'm mostly along for the ride. I'm not trying to stir things up. I am very passive in my research and posting. I could move much faster -- and in a much more radical manner. I use contextual superimposition for mental and spiritual conditioning. I produce mixed-up posts on purpose -- for a purpose -- believe it or not. I'm sort of the smart@$$ down the hall from the Real-Deal in the Solar-System Nerve-Center (in my imagination). Regarding the Bible -- consider getting in-touch with whoever wrote the original autographs -- and with the King James translators -- even if you doubt and disagree to the nth degree. Perhaps the Bible is more of a puzzle and a test than we can imagine. Consider a careful prophetic study of:

1. Psalms.
2. Isaiah.
3. Daniel.
4. Matthew.
5. Revelation.

I am despairing regarding properly understanding what's really going-on in this solar system (past, present, and future). I keep receiving flashes of insight (which are probably due to a volatile mixture of inspiration and perspiration) -- but I can't prove or debate anything of significance. I have an overwhelming urge to just shut-up and research (and not communicate with anyone). I suspect that most (if not all) of us will simply have to learn the hard-way. This Thread is truly a Road Less Traveled Research Project (with no funding and no prospects). We All Have Our Crosses to Bear. I Am of Peace. Always.

I hope that some of you have received some benefit from this thread. I doubt that it's made any of you happy. I'd expect just the opposite. It certainly has not made me happy. I wish to repeat that I haven't been out to get anyone. I don't know enough to be able to responsibly do that sort of thing! When I refer to Desmond Ford, Ellen White, Ralph Ellis, Joseph Farrell, William Bramley, Bill Cooper, Alex Jones, Alex Collier, Jim Marrs, et al -- I honestly have no idea how accurate any of them are. I honestly don't know what hidden agendas they might have. I honestly don't know who they might work for. I'm just trying to create a balanced and rational context for some of you to seriously attempt to understand what might really be going on in this world, solar system, galaxy, and universe. I am NOT shaking my fist at the Powers That Be. I have NO Idea what they might be dealing with. I honestly don't. Has anyone thought about the possibility that we might be nearly 900 years into a 1,000 year Templar-Millenium -- and nearly 2,200 years into a 2,300 year Roman-Empire?? Has anyone (other than me) suggested the possibility that a Completely Ethical and Righteous Kingdom of God might commence around 2133AD?? Has anyone considered that the movie Noah might signal the beginning of a 120 year (Preaching of Noah parallel) Disclosure and Judgment (aka Investigative-Judgment??) -- in the context of an Open New World Order?? As it was in the Days of Noah?? What if the First Shall be Last?? What if 2133AD will be the approximate date of a Galactic Executive Judgment?? This is terrifying stuff to contemplate!! I suspect that 99.9% of us have no idea what's really going on. I know I don't. Here's a book by Lewis Walton, which you might find interesting. Another one is pictured below. http://www.amazon.com/Advent-World-Events-End-Time/dp/0828003491/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1399085497&sr=8-1&keywords=lewis+walton+advent

Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Fri Feb 12, 2016 6:48 pm; edited 2 times in total

orthodoxymoron

Posts : 7483
Join date : 2010-09-28

Daniel 8: 1 In the third year of the reign of king Belshazzar a vision appeared unto me, even unto me Daniel, after that which appeared unto me at the first.  2 And I saw in a vision; and it came to pass, when I saw , that I was at Shushan in the palace, which is in the province of Elam; and I saw in a vision, and I was by the river of Ulai.  3 Then I lifted up mine eyes, and saw , and, behold, there stood before the river a ram which had two horns: and the two horns were high; but one was higher than the other, and the higher came up last.  4 I saw the ram pushing westward, and northward, and southward; so that no beasts might stand before him, neither was there any that could deliver out of his hand; but he did according to his will, and became great .  5 And as I was considering , behold, an he goat came from the west on the face of the whole earth, and touched not the ground: and the goat had a notable horn between his eyes.  6 And he came to the ram that had two horns, which I had seen standing before the river, and ran unto him in the fury of his power.  7 And I saw him come close unto the ram, and he was moved with choler against him, and smote the ram, and brake his two horns: and there was no power in the ram to stand before him, but he cast him down to the ground, and stamped upon him: and there was none that could deliver the ram out of his hand.  8 Therefore the he goat waxed very great : and when he was strong , the great horn was broken ; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.  9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great , toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.  10 And it waxed great , even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.  11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away , and the place of his sanctuary was cast down .  12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised , and prospered .  13 Then I heard one saint speaking , and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake , How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation , to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?  14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days  ; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed .  15 And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man.  16 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called , and said , Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.  17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came , I was afraid , and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand , O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.  18 Now as he was speaking with me, I was in a deep sleep on my face toward the ground: but he touched me, and set me upright.  19 And he said , Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be.  20 The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia.  21 And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king.  22 Now that being broken , whereas four stood up for it, four kingdoms shall stand up out of the nation, but not in his power.  23 And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full , a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up .  24 And his power shall be mighty , but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully , and shall prosper , and practise , and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.  25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.  26 And the vision of the evening and the morning which was told is true: wherefore shut thou up the vision; for it shall be for many days.  27 And I Daniel fainted , and was sick certain days; afterward I rose up , and did the king's business; and I was astonished at the vision, but none understood it.

Daniel 9: 1 In the first year of Darius the son of Ahasuerus, of the seed of the Medes, which was made king over the realm of the Chaldeans;  2 In the first year of his reign I Daniel understood by books the number of the years, whereof the word of the LORD came to Jeremiah the prophet, that he would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem.  3 And I set my face unto the Lord God, to seek by prayer and supplications, with fasting, and sackcloth, and ashes:  4 And I prayed unto the LORD my God, and made my confession , and said , O Lord, the great and dreadful God, keeping the covenant and mercy to them that love him, and to them that keep his commandments;  5 We have sinned , and have committed iniquity , and have done wickedly , and have rebelled , even by departing from thy precepts and from thy judgments:  6 Neither have we hearkened unto thy servants the prophets, which spake in thy name to our kings, our princes, and our fathers, and to all the people of the land.  7 O Lord, righteousness belongeth unto thee, but unto us confusion of faces, as at this day; to the men of Judah, and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and unto all Israel, that are near, and that are far off, through all the countries whither thou hast driven them, because of their trespass that they have trespassed against thee.  8 O Lord, to us belongeth confusion of face, to our kings, to our princes, and to our fathers, because we have sinned against thee.  9 To the Lord our God belong mercies and forgivenesses, though we have rebelled against him;  10 Neither have we obeyed the voice of the LORD our God, to walk in his laws, which he set before us by his servants the prophets.  11 Yea, all Israel have transgressed thy law, even by departing , that they might not obey thy voice; therefore the curse is poured upon us, and the oath that is written in the law of Moses the servant of God, because we have sinned against him.  12 And he hath confirmed his words, which he spake against us, and against our judges that judged us, by bringing upon us a great evil: for under the whole heaven hath not been done as hath been done upon Jerusalem.  13 As it is written in the law of Moses, all this evil is come upon us: yet made we not our prayer before the LORD our God, that we might turn from our iniquities, and understand thy truth.  14 Therefore hath the LORD watched upon the evil, and brought it upon us: for the LORD our God is righteous in all his works which he doeth : for we obeyed not his voice.  15 And now, O Lord our God, that hast brought thy people forth out of the land of Egypt with a mighty hand, and hast gotten thee renown, as at this day; we have sinned , we have done wickedly .  16 O Lord, according to all thy righteousness, I beseech thee, let thine anger and thy fury be turned away from thy city Jerusalem, thy holy mountain: because for our sins, and for the iniquities of our fathers, Jerusalem and thy people are become a reproach to all that are about us.  17 Now therefore, O our God, hear the prayer of thy servant, and his supplications, and cause thy face to shine upon thy sanctuary that is desolate, for the Lord's sake.  18 O my God, incline thine ear, and hear ; open thine eyes, and behold our desolations , and the city which is called by thy name: for we do not present our supplications before thee for our righteousnesses, but for thy great mercies.  19 O Lord, hear ; O Lord, forgive ; O Lord, hearken and do ; defer not, for thine own sake, O my God: for thy city and thy people are called by thy name.  20 And whiles I was speaking , and praying , and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God;  21 Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation.  22 And he informed me, and talked with me, and said , O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding.  23 At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth , and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision.  24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.  25 Know therefore and understand , that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again , and the wall, even in troublous times.  26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off , but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined .  27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease , and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate , even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate .

Daniel 10: 1 In the third year of Cyrus king of Persia a thing was revealed unto Daniel, whose name was called Belteshazzar; and the thing was true, but the time appointed was long: and he understood the thing, and had understanding of the vision.  2 In those days I Daniel was mourning three full weeks.  3 I ate no pleasant bread, neither came flesh nor wine in my mouth, neither did I anoint myself at all , till three whole weeks were fulfilled .  4 And in the four and twentieth day of the first month, as I was by the side of the great river, which is Hiddekel;  5 Then I lifted up mine eyes, and looked , and behold a certain man clothed in linen, whose loins were girded with fine gold of Uphaz:  6 His body also was like the beryl, and his face as the appearance of lightning, and his eyes as lamps of fire, and his arms and his feet like in colour to polished brass, and the voice of his words like the voice of a multitude.  7 And I Daniel alone saw the vision: for the men that were with me saw not the vision; but a great quaking fell upon them, so that they fled to hide themselves.  8 Therefore I was left alone , and saw this great vision, and there remained no strength in me: for my comeliness was turned in me into corruption, and I retained no strength.  9 Yet heard I the voice of his words: and when I heard the voice of his words, then was I in a deep sleep on my face, and my face toward the ground.  10 And, behold, an hand touched me, which set me upon my knees and upon the palms of my hands.  11 And he said unto me, O Daniel, a man greatly beloved, understand the words that I speak unto thee, and stand upright: for unto thee am I now sent . And when he had spoken this word unto me, I stood trembling .  12 Then said he unto me, Fear not, Daniel: for from the first day that thou didst set thine heart to understand , and to chasten thyself before thy God, thy words were heard , and I am come for thy words.  13 But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia.  14 Now I am come to make thee understand what shall befall thy people in the latter days: for yet the vision is for many days.  15 And when he had spoken such words unto me, I set my face toward the ground, and I became dumb .  16 And, behold, one like the similitude of the sons of men touched my lips: then I opened my mouth, and spake , and said unto him that stood before me, O my lord, by the vision my sorrows are turned upon me, and I have retained no strength.  17 For how can the servant of this my lord talk with this my lord? for as for me, straightway there remained no strength in me, neither is there breath left in me.  18 Then there came again and touched me one like the appearance of a man, and he strengthened me,  19 And said , O man greatly beloved, fear not: peace be unto thee, be strong , yea, be strong . And when he had spoken unto me, I was strengthened , and said , Let my lord speak ; for thou hast strengthened me.  20 Then said he, Knowest thou wherefore I come unto thee? and now will I return to fight with the prince of Persia: and when I am gone forth , lo, the prince of Grecia shall come .  21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince.

Daniel 11: 1 Also I in the first year of Darius the Mede, even I, stood to confirm and to strengthen him.  2 And now will I shew thee the truth. Behold, there shall stand up yet three kings in Persia; and the fourth shall be far richer than they all: and by his strength through his riches he shall stir up all against the realm of Grecia.  3 And a mighty king shall stand up , that shall rule with great dominion, and do according to his will.  4 And when he shall stand up , his kingdom shall be broken , and shall be divided toward the four winds of heaven; and not to his posterity, nor according to his dominion which he ruled : for his kingdom shall be plucked up , even for others beside those.  5 And the king of the south shall be strong , and one of his princes; and he shall be strong above him, and have dominion ; his dominion shall be a great dominion.  6 And in the end of years they shall join themselves together ; for the king's daughter of the south shall come to the king of the north to make an agreement: but she shall not retain the power of the arm; neither shall he stand , nor his arm: but she shall be given up , and they that brought her, and he that begat her, and he that strengthened her in these times.  7 But out of a branch of her roots shall one stand up in his estate, which shall come with an army, and shall enter into the fortress of the king of the north, and shall deal against them, and shall prevail :  8 And shall also carry captives into Egypt their gods, with their princes, and with their precious vessels of silver and of gold; and he shall continue more years than the king of the north.  9 So the king of the south shall come into his kingdom, and shall return into his own land.  10 But his sons shall be stirred up , and shall assemble a multitude of great forces: and one shall certainly come , and overflow , and pass through : then shall he return , and be stirred up , even to his fortress.  11 And the king of the south shall be moved with choler , and shall come forth and fight with him, even with the king of the north: and he shall set forth a great multitude; but the multitude shall be given into his hand.  12 And when he hath taken away the multitude, his heart shall be lifted up ; and he shall cast down many ten thousands: but he shall not be strengthened by it.  13 For the king of the north shall return , and shall set forth a multitude greater than the former, and shall certainly come after certain years with a great army and with much riches.  14 And in those times there shall many stand up against the king of the south: also the robbers of thy people shall exalt themselves to establish the vision; but they shall fall .  15 So the king of the north shall come , and cast up a mount, and take the most fenced cities: and the arms of the south shall not withstand , neither his chosen people, neither shall there be any strength to withstand .  16 But he that cometh against him shall do according to his own will, and none shall stand before him: and he shall stand in the glorious land, which by his hand shall be consumed.  17 He shall also set his face to enter with the strength of his whole kingdom, and upright ones with him; thus shall he do : and he shall give him the daughter of women, corrupting her: but she shall not stand on his side, neither be for him.  18 After this shall he turn his face unto the isles, and shall take many: but a prince for his own behalf shall cause the reproach offered by him to cease ; without his own reproach he shall cause it to turn upon him.  19 Then he shall turn his face toward the fort of his own land: but he shall stumble and fall , and not be found .  20 Then shall stand up in his estate a raiser of taxes in the glory of the kingdom: but within few days he shall be destroyed , neither in anger, nor in battle.  21 And in his estate shall stand up a vile person , to whom they shall not give the honour of the kingdom: but he shall come in peaceably, and obtain the kingdom by flatteries.  22 And with the arms of a flood shall they be overflown from before him, and shall be broken ; yea, also the prince of the covenant.  23 And after the league made with him he shall work deceitfully: for he shall come up , and shall become strong with a small people.  24 He shall enter peaceably even upon the fattest places of the province; and he shall do that which his fathers have not done , nor his fathers' fathers; he shall scatter among them the prey, and spoil, and riches: yea, and he shall forecast his devices against the strong holds, even for a time.  25 And he shall stir up his power and his courage against the king of the south with a great army; and the king of the south shall be stirred up to battle with a very great and mighty army; but he shall not stand : for they shall forecast devices against him.  26 Yea, they that feed of the portion of his meat shall destroy him, and his army shall overflow : and many shall fall down slain.  27 And both these kings' hearts shall be to do mischief  , and they shall speak lies at one table; but it shall not prosper : for yet the end shall be at the time appointed.  28 Then shall he return into his land with great riches; and his heart shall be against the holy covenant; and he shall do exploits, and return to his own land.  29 At the time appointed he shall return , and come toward the south; but it shall not be as the former, or as the latter.  30 For the ships of Chittim shall come against him: therefore he shall be grieved , and return , and have indignation against the holy covenant: so shall he do ; he shall even return , and have intelligence with them that forsake the holy covenant.  31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate .  32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong , and do exploits.  33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.  34 Now when they shall fall , they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.  35 And some of them of understanding shall fall , to try them, and to purge , and to make them white , even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.  36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished : for that that is determined shall be done .  37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.  38 But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.  39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.  40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind , with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over .  41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown : but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.  42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape.  43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps.  44 But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy , and utterly to make away many.  45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.

Daniel 12: 1 And at that time shall Michael stand up , the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered , every one that shall be found written in the book.  2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake , some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.  3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.  4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro , and knowledge shall be increased .  5 Then I Daniel looked , and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river.  6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?  7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished .  8 And I heard , but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?  9 And he said , Go thy way , Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.  10 Many shall be purified , and made white , and tried ; but the wicked shall do wickedly : and none of the wicked shall understand ; but the wise shall understand .  11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away , and the abomination that maketh desolate set up , there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.  12 Blessed is he that waiteth , and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.  13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest , and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

28 And it came to pass , when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:  29 For he taught  them as one having authority, and not as the scribes.

Matthew 24: 1 And Jesus went out , and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.  2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.  3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately , saying , Tell us, when shall these things be ? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?  4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.  5 For many shall come in my name, saying , I am Christ; and shall deceive many.  6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled : for all these things must come to pass , but the end is not yet.  7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.  8 All  these are the beginning of sorrows.  9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.  10 And then shall many be offended , and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.  11 And many false prophets shall rise , and shall deceive many.  12 And because iniquity shall abound , the love of many shall wax cold .  13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved .  14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come .  15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth , let him understand :)  16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:  17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:  18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.  19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!  20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:  21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be .  22 And except those days should be shortened , there should no flesh be saved : but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened .  23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo , here is Christ, or there; believe it not.  24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.  25 Behold , I have told you before .  26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold , he is in the desert; go not forth : behold , he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.  27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be .  28 For wheresoever the carcase is , there will the eagles be gathered together .  29 Immediately  after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened , and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken :  30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn , and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.  31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other .  32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:  33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.  34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass , till  all these things be fulfilled .  35 Heaven and earth shall pass away , but my words shall not pass away .  36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.  37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be .  38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking , marrying and giving in marriage , until the day that Noe entered into the ark,  39 And knew not until the flood came , and took them all away ; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be .  40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken , and the other left .  41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken , and the other left .  42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come .  43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come , he would have watched , and would not have suffered his house to be broken up .  44 Therefore  be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh .  45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?  46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing .  47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods .  48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming ;  49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken ;  50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of ,  51 And shall cut him asunder , and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Fri Feb 12, 2016 6:51 pm; edited 1 time in total

orthodoxymoron

Posts : 7483
Join date : 2010-09-28
Revelation 12: 1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:  2 And she being with child cried , travailing in birth , and pained to be delivered .  3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.  4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered , for to devour her child as soon as it was born .  5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.  6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.  7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,  8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.  9 And the great dragon was cast out , that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.  10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down , which accused them before our God day and night.  11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.  12 Therefore  rejoice , ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.  13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.  14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time , and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.  15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.  16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.  17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 15: 1 And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God.  2 And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.  3 And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying , Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.  4 Who shall not fear thee, O Lord, and glorify thy name? for thou only art holy: for all nations shall come and worship before thee; for thy judgments are made manifest .  5 And after that I looked , and, behold , the temple of the tabernacle of the testimony in heaven was opened :  6 And the seven angels came out of the temple, having the seven plagues, clothed in pure and white linen, and having their breasts girded with golden girdles.  7 And one of the four beasts gave unto the seven angels seven golden vials full of the wrath of God, who liveth for ever and ever.  8 And the temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God, and from his power; and no man was able to enter into the temple, till the seven plagues of the seven angels were fulfilled .

Revelation 16: 1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways , and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.  2 And the first went , and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.  3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.  4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and  fountains of waters; and they became blood.  5 And I heard the angel of the waters say , Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art , and wast , and shalt be , because thou hast judged thus.  6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink ; for they are worthy.  7 And I heard another out of the altar say , Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.  8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.  9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.  10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness ; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,  11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and  their sores, and repented not of their deeds.  12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up , that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared .  13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.  14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.  15 Behold , I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth , and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.  16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.  17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying , It is done .  18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since  men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.  19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell : and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.  20 And every island fled away , and the mountains were not found .  21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great.

Revelation 17: 1 And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither ; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:  2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication , and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.  3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.  4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:  5 And upon her forehead was a name written , MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.  6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.  7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel ? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns.  8 The beast that thou sawest was , and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder , whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was  , and is not, and yet is .  9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth  .  10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen , and one is , and the other is not yet come ; and when he cometh , he must continue a short space.  11 And the beast that was , and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.  12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.  13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.  14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.  15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest , where the whore sitteth , are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.  16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.  17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree  , and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled .  18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth  over the kings of the earth.

Revelation 18: 1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.  2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying , Babylon the great is fallen , is fallen , and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.  3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.  4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying , Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.  5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.  6 Reward her even as she  rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double.  7 How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously , so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow.  8 Therefore  shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.  9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,  10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying , Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come .  11 And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more:  12 The merchandise of gold, and silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and fine linen, and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner vessels of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble,  13 And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men.  14 And the fruits that thy soul lusted after are departed from thee, and all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee, and thou shalt find them no more at all.  15 The merchants of these things, which were made rich by her, shall stand afar off for the fear of her torment, weeping and wailing ,  16 And saying , Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls!  17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought . And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off,  18 And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying , What city is like unto this great city!  19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried , weeping and wailing , saying , Alas, alas, that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate .  20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged  you on her.  21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying , Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down , and shall be found no more at all.  22 And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no  craftsman, of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee;  23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived .  24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Revelation 19: 1 And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying , Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God:  2 For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand.  3 And again they said , Alleluia. And her smoke rose up for ever and ever.  4 And the four and twenty elders and the four beasts fell down and worshipped God that sat on the throne, saying , Amen; Alleluia.  5 And a voice came out of the throne, saying , Praise our God, all ye his servants, and ye that fear him, both small and great.  6 And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying , Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth .  7 Let us be glad and rejoice , and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come , and his wife hath made herself ready .  8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.  9 And he saith unto me, Write , Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.  10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.  11 And I saw heaven opened , and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war .  12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written , that no man knew , but he himself.  13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.  14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.  15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.  16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written , KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.  17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;  18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.  19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.  20 And the beast was taken , and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.  21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Revelation 21: 1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away ; and there was no more sea.  2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.  3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying , Behold , the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.  4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away .  5 And he that sat upon the throne said , Behold , I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write : for these words are true and faithful.  6 And he said unto me, It is done . I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.  7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.  8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable , and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.  9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying , Come hither , I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.  10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,  11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal ;  12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon , which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:  13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.  14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.  15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.  16 And the city lieth foursquare, and the length  is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed , twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.  17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is , of the angel.  18 And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.  19 And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;  20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.  21 And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every  several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.  22 And I saw no temple therein  : for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.  23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.  24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.  25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.  26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.  27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth , neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Revelation 22: 1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.  2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every   month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.  3 And there shall be no more  curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:  4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.  5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle  , neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light : and they shall reign for ever and ever.  6 And he said unto me, These sayings are faithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants the things which must shortly be done .  7 Behold , I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.  8 And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen , I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things.  9 Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.  10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.  11 He that is unjust , let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy , let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.  12 And, behold , I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be .  13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.  14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.  15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.  16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.  17 And the Spirit and the bride say , Come . And let him that heareth say , Come . And let him that is athirst come . And whosoever will , let him take the water of life freely.  18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:  19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.  20 He which testifieth these things saith , Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come , Lord Jesus.  21 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Fri Feb 12, 2016 6:53 pm; edited 1 time in total

orthodoxymoron

Posts : 7483
Join date : 2010-09-28

There are a lot of "Delusional-Systems" which actually work (for a while)!! The common-denominator seems to be Dishonesty and Irresponsibility. I am very conflicted regarding the state of Earth and Humanity. What seems to be lacking (for me) is not knowing how things really work "out there" throughout the universe. I have been doing a lot of dark-speculation regarding what "we" might be dealing with "out there". But really, I don't know who's side I'm really on (going way back). I don't know if I've been historically for or against humanity (on a soul-basis for thousands of years). I've recently been considering a United States of the Solar System (guided by the Perfect Laws of the Lord) as being at least a "stand-in" solution. But more recently, I've been speculating that the End of the World might occur around 2133 AD (based upon a radical interpretation of Daniel 8:14) preceded by 120 years of "Disclosure" in an "Investigative-Judgment" followed by an "Executive-Judgment". I have no idea if this concept has any validity. I don't know much of anything for certain. I am truly "at sea". What if the "Devil" is essentially a Bad@Solar System CEO??!! What if the "Devil" has an office at Goldman Sachs??!! What if humanity did something really, really bad in antiquity -- and is being punished by the "Devil"??!! What if I've actually talked to the "Devil" in a non-creepy context??!! BTW -- I'm presently wearing a Fedora (given to me by an Ancient Egyptian Deity) and a "Venkman" Ghostbusters shirt (with ectoplasm which glows in the dark)!! Incidentally, I also drive a Cadillac (but not a '59')!! I used to drive an AMC Pacer!! I also used to drive a taxi!! What Would George Burns Say?? What Would John Denver Say?? What Would Peter Venkman Say?? What Would Isaac Newton Say?? I wish I were making this stuff up. I really do. Oh God!! I can't take much more of this madness!! One more thing. What is Revelation 13:8 referring to?? Namaste and Godspeed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Newton%27s_occult_studies Sir Isaac Newton (1642–1727), the noted English scientist and mathematician, wrote many works that would now be classified as occult studies. These occult works explored chronology, alchemy, and Biblical interpretation (especially of the Apocalypse). Newton's scientific work may have been of lesser personal importance to him, as he placed emphasis on rediscovering the occult wisdom of the ancients. In this sense, some[1] believe that any reference to a "Newtonian Worldview" as being purely mechanical in nature is somewhat inaccurate. After purchasing and studying Newton's alchemical works in 1942, economist John Maynard Keynes, for example, opined that "Newton was not the first of the age of reason, he was the last of the magicians". In the Early Modern Period of Newton's lifetime, the educated embraced a world view different from that of later centuries. Distinctions between science, superstition, and pseudoscience were still being formulated, and a devoutly Christian Biblical perspective permeated Western culture. Much of what are known as Isaac Newton's occult studies can largely be attributed to his study of alchemy.[2] Newton was deeply interested in all forms of natural sciences and materials science, an interest which would ultimately lead to some of his better-known contributions to science. During Newton's lifetime the study of chemistry was still in its infancy, so many of his experimental studies used esoteric language and vague terminology more typically associated with alchemy and occultism.[3] It was not until several decades after Newton's death that experiments of stoichiometry under the pioneering works of Antoine Lavoisier were conducted, and analytical chemistry, with its associated nomenclature, came to resemble modern chemistry as we know it today. However, Newton's contemporary and fellow Royal Society member, Robert Boyle, had already discovered the basic concepts of modern chemistry and began establishing modern norms of experimental practice and communication in chemistry, information which Newton did not utilize. Much of Newton's writing on alchemy may have been lost in a fire in his laboratory, so the true extent of his work in this area may have been larger than is currently known. Newton also suffered a nervous breakdown during his period of alchemical work, which is thought by some to have resulted from the psychological transformation alchemy was originally designed to induce[citation needed], though there is also speculation that it may have been some form of chemical poisoning (possibly from mercury, lead, or some other substance).[4] There is a probably apocryphal account of Newton's lab fire. In the story, Newton's dog started the fire, burning 20 years of research. Newton is thought to have said, "O Diamond, Diamond, thou little knowest the mischief thou hast done."[5] Newton's writings suggest that one of the main goals of his alchemy may have been the discovery of The Philosopher's Stone (a material believed to turn base metals into gold), and perhaps to a lesser extent, the discovery of the highly coveted Elixir of Life.[4] Newton reportedly believed that a Diana's Tree, an alchemical demonstration producing a dendritic "growth" of silver from solution, was evidence that metals "possessed a sort of life."[6] Some practices of alchemy were banned in England during Newton's lifetime, due in part to unscrupulous practitioners who would often promise wealthy benefactors unrealistic results in an attempt to swindle them. The English Crown, also fearing the potential devaluation of gold, should The Philosopher's Stone actually be discovered, made penalties for alchemy very severe. In some cases the punishment for unsanctioned alchemy would include the public hanging of an offender on a gilded scaffold while adorned with tinsel and other unspecified items.[4] Due to the threat of punishment and the potential scrutiny he feared from his peers within the scientific community, Newton may have deliberately left his work on alchemical subjects unpublished. Newton was well known as being highly sensitive to criticism, such as the numerous instances when he was criticized by Robert Hooke, and his admitted reluctance to publish any substantial information regarding calculus before 1693. A perfectionist by nature, Newton also refrained from publication of material that he felt was incomplete, as evident from a 38-year gap from Newton's conception of calculus in 1666 and its final full publication in 1704, which would ultimately lead to the infamous Leibniz–Newton calculus controversy. In 1936, a collection of Isaac Newton's unpublished works were auctioned by Sotheby's on behalf of Gerard Wallop, 9th Earl of Portsmouth, who had inherited them from Newton's great-niece. Known as the "Portsmouth Papers", this material consisted of three hundred and twenty-nine lots of Newton's manuscripts, over a third of which were filled with content that appeared to be alchemical in nature. At the time of Newton's death this material was considered "unfit to publish" by Newton's estate, and consequently fell into obscurity until their somewhat sensational reemergence in 1936.[7] At the auction many of these documents were purchased by economist John Maynard Keynes, who throughout his life collected many of Newton's alchemical writings. Much of the Keynes collection later passed to eccentric document collector Abraham Yahuda, who was himself a vigorous collector of Isaac Newton's original manuscripts. Many of the documents collected by Keynes and Yahuda are now in the Jewish National and University Library in Jerusalem. In recent years, several projects have begun to gather, catalogue, and transcribe the fragmented collection of Newton's work on alchemical subjects and make them freely available for on-line access. Two of these are The Chymistry of Isaac Newton Project[8] supported by the U.S. National Science Foundation, and The Newton Project[9] supported by the U.K. Arts and Humanities Research Board. In addition, The Jewish National and University Library has published a number of high-quality scanned images of various Newton documents.[10] Of the material sold during the 1936 Sotheby's auction, several documents indicate an interest by Newton in the procurement or development of the Philosopher's Stone. Most notably are documents entitled Artephius his secret Book, followed by The Epistle of Iohn Pontanus, wherein he beareth witness of ye book of Artephius; these are themselves a collection of excerpts from another work entitled Nicholas Flammel, His Exposition of the Hieroglyphicall Figures which he caused to be painted upon an Arch in St Innocents Church-yard in Paris. Together with The secret Booke of Artephius, And the Epistle of Iohn Pontanus: Containing both the Theoricke and the Practicke of the Philosophers Stone. This work may also have been referenced by Newton in its Latin version found within Lazarus Zetzner's Theatrum Chemicum, a volume often associated with the Turba Philosophorum and other early European alchemical manuscripts. Nicolas Flamel, one subject of the aforementioned work, was a notable, though mysterious figure, often associated with the discovery of the Philosopher's Stone, hieroglyphical figures, early forms of tarot, and occultism. Artephius, and his "secret book", were also subjects of interest to 17th century alchemists. Also in the 1936 auction of Newton's collection was, The Epitome of the treasure of health written by Edwardus Generosus Anglicus innominatus who lived Anno Domini 1562. This is a twenty-eight page treatise on the Philosopher's Stone, the Animal or Angelicall Stone, the Prospective stone or magical stone of Moses, and the vegetable or the growing stone. The treatise concludes with an alchemical poem. In a manuscript he wrote in 1704 in which he describes his attempts to extract scientific information from the Bible, Newton estimated that the world would end no earlier than 2060. In predicting this he said, "This I mention not to assert when the time of the end shall be, but to put a stop to the rash conjectures of fanciful men who are frequently predicting the time of the end, and by doing so bring the sacred prophesies into discredit as often as their predictions fail."[11] Newton studied and wrote extensively upon the Temple of Solomon, dedicating an entire chapter of The Chronology of Ancient Kingdoms to his observations regarding the temple. Newton's primary source for information was the description of the structure given within 1 Kings of the Hebrew Bible, which he translated himself from Hebrew.[12] Isaac Newton's diagram of part of the Temple of Solomon, taken from Plate 1 of The Chronology of Ancient Kingdoms. Published London, 1728. In addition to scripture, Newton also relied upon various ancient and contemporary sources while studying the temple. He believed that many ancient sources were endowed with sacred wisdom[4] and that the proportions of many of their temples were in themselves sacred. This belief would lead Newton to examine many architectural works of Hellenistic Greece, as well as Roman sources such as Vitruvius, in a search for their occult knowledge. This concept, often termed prisca sapientia (sacred wisdom and also the ancient wisdom that was revealed to Adam and Moses directly by God), was a common belief of many scholars during Newton's lifetime.[13] A more contemporary source for Newton's studies of the temple was Juan Bautista Villalpando, who just a few decades earlier had published an influential manuscript entitled Ezechielem Explanationes, in which Villalpando comments on the visions of the biblical prophet Ezekiel, including within this work his own interpretations and elaborate reconstructions of Solomon's Temple. In its time, Villalpando's work on the temple produced a great deal of interest throughout Europe and had a significant impact upon later architects and scholars.[14][15] As a Bible scholar, Newton was initially interested in the sacred geometry of Solomon's Temple, such as golden sections, conic sections, spirals, orthographic projection, and other harmonious constructions, but he also believed that the dimensions and proportions represented more. He noted that the temple's measurements given in the Bible are mathematical problems, related to solutions for \pi and the volume of a hemisphere, V = (2/3)\pi r^3, and in a larger sense that they were references to the size of the Earth and man's place and proportion to it.[citation needed] Newton believed that the temple was designed by King Solomon with privileged eyes and divine guidance. To Newton, the geometry of the temple represented more than a mathematical blueprint, it also provided a time-frame chronology of Hebrew history.[16] It was for this reason that he included a chapter devoted to the temple within The Chronology of Ancient Kingdoms, a section which initially may seem unrelated to the historical nature of the book as a whole. Newton felt that just as the writings of ancient philosophers, scholars, and Biblical figures contained within them unknown sacred wisdom, the same was true of their architecture. He believed that these men had hidden their knowledge in a complex code of symbolic and mathematical language that, when deciphered, would reveal an unknown knowledge of how nature works.[13] In 1675 Newton annotated a copy of Manna - a disquisition of the nature of alchemy, an anonymous treatise which had been given to him by his fellow scholar Ezekiel Foxcroft. In his annotation Newton reflected upon his reasons for examining Solomon's Temple by writing: This philosophy, both speculative and active, is not only to be found in the volume of nature, but also in the sacred scriptures, as in Genesis, Job, Psalms, Isaiah and others. In the knowledge of this philosophy, God made Solomon the greatest philosopher in the world.[16] During Newton's lifetime, there was great interest in the Temple of Solomon in Europe, due to the success of Villalpando's publications, and augmented by a vogue for detailed engravings and physical models presented in various galleries for public viewing. In 1628, Judah Leon Templo produced a model of the temple and surrounding Jerusalem, which was popular in its day. Around 1692, Gerhard Schott produced a highly detailed model of the temple for use in an opera in Hamburg composed by Christian Heinrich Postel. This immense 13-foot-high (4.0 m) and 80-foot-around (24 m) model was later sold in 1725 and was exhibited in London as early as 1723, and then later temporarily installed at the London Royal Exchange from 1729–1730, where it could be viewed for half-a-crown. Sir Isaac Newton's most comprehensive work on the temple, found within The Chronology of Ancient Kingdoms, was published posthumously in 1728, only adding to the public interest in the temple.[17] Newton considered himself to be one of a select group of individuals who were specially chosen by God for the task of understanding Biblical scripture.[18] He was a strong believer in prophetic interpretation of the Bible, and like many of his contemporaries in Protestant England, he developed a strong affinity and deep admiration for the teachings and works of Joseph Mede. Though he never wrote a cohesive body of work on prophecy, Newton's belief led him to write several treatises on the subject, including an unpublished guide for prophetic interpretation entitled Rules for interpreting the words & language in Scripture. In this manuscript he details the necessary requirements for what he considered to be the proper interpretation of the Bible. In addition, Newton would spend much of his life seeking and revealing what could be considered a Bible Code. He placed a great deal of emphasis upon the interpretation of the Book of Revelation, writing generously upon this book and authoring several manuscripts detailing his interpretations. Unlike a prophet in the true sense of the word, Newton relied upon existing Scripture to prophesy for him, believing his interpretations would set the record straight in the face of what he considered to be "so little understood".[19] In 1754, 27 years after his death, Isaac Newton's treatise, An Historical Account of Two Notable Corruptions of Scripture would be published, and though it does not argue any prophetic meaning, it does exemplify what Newton considered to be just one popular misunderstanding of Scripture. Although Newton's approach to these studies could not be considered a scientific approach, he did write as if his findings were the result of evidence-based research. In late February and early March 2003, a large amount of media attention circulated around the globe regarding largely unknown and unpublished documents, evidently written by Isaac Newton, indicating that he believed the world would end no earlier than 2060. The story garnered vast amounts of public interest and found its way onto the front page of several widely distributed newspapers, including the UK's Daily Telegraph, Canada's National Post, Israel's Maariv and Yediot Aharonot, and was also featured in an article in the scientific journal, Canadian Journal of History.[20] Television and Internet stories in the following weeks heightened the exposure and ultimately would include the production of several documentary films focused upon the topic of the 2060 prediction and some of Newton's lesser known beliefs and practices. The two documents detailing this prediction are currently housed within the Jewish National and University Library in Jerusalem.[20] Both were believed to be written toward the end of Newton's life, circa 1705, a time frame most notably established by the use of the full title of Sir Isaac Newton within portions of the documents. These documents do not appear to have been written with the intention of publication and Newton expressed a strong personal dislike for individuals who provided specific dates for the Apocalypse purely for sensational value. Furthermore, he at no time provides a specific date for the end of the world in either of these documents.[20] To understand the reasoning behind the 2060 prediction, an understanding of Newton's theological beliefs should be taken into account, particularly his apparent antitrinitarian beliefs and his Protestant views on the Papacy. Both of these lay essential to his calculations, which ultimately would provide the 2060 time frame. See Isaac Newton's religious views for more details. The first document, part of the Yahuda collection,[21] is a small letter slip, on the back of which is written haphazardly in Newton's hand: Prop. 1. The 2300 prophetick days did not commence before the rise of the little horn of the He Goat. 2 Those day [sic] did not commence a[f]ter the destruction of Jerusalem & ye Temple by the Romans A.[D.] 70. 3 The time times & half a time did not commence before the year 800 in wch the Popes supremacy commenced 4 They did not commence after the re[ig]ne of Gregory the 7th. 1084 5 The 1290 days did not commence b[e]fore the year 842. 6 They did not commence after the reigne of Pope Greg. 7th. 1084 7 The diffence [sic] between the 1290 & 1335 days are a parts of the seven weeks. Therefore the 2300 years do not end before ye year 2132 nor after 2370. The time times & half time do n[o]t end before 2060 nor after [2344] The 1290 days do not begin [this should read: end] before 2090 nor after 1374 [sic; Newton probably means 2374][20] The second reference to the 2060 prediction can be found in a folio,[22] in which Newton writes: So then the time times & half a time are 42 months or 1260 days or three years & an half, recconing twelve months to a yeare & 30 days to a month as was done in the Calendar of the primitive year. And the days of short lived Beasts being put for the years of lived [sic for "long lived"] kingdoms, the period of 1260 days, if dated from the complete conquest of the three kings A.C. 800, will end A.C. 2060. It may end later, but I see no reason for its ending sooner. This I mention not to assert when the time of the end shall be, but to put a stop to the rash conjectures of fancifull men who are frequently predicting the time of the end, & by doing so bring the sacred prophesies into discredit as often as their predictions fail. Christ comes as a thief in the night, & it is not for us to know the times & seasons wch God hath put into his own breast.[20] Clearly Newton's mathematical prediction of the end of the world is one derived from his interpretation of not only scripture, but also one based upon his theological viewpoint regarding specific chronological dates and events as he saw them. Newton may not have been referring to the post 2060 event as a destructive act resulting in the annihilation of the globe and its inhabitants, but rather one in which he believed the world, as he saw it, was to be replaced with a new one based upon a transition to an era of divinely inspired peace. In Christian and Islamic theology this concept is often referred to as The Second Coming of Jesus Christ and the establishment of The Kingdom of God on Earth. In a separate manuscript,[23] Isaac Newton paraphrases Revelation 21 and 22 and relates the post 2060 events by writing: A new heaven & new earth. New Jerusalem comes down from heaven prepared as a Bride adorned for her husband. The marriage supper. God dwells with men wipes away all tears from their eyes, gives them of ye fountain of living water & creates all thin things new saying, It is done. The glory & felicity of the New Jerusalem is represented by a building of Gold & Gemms enlightened by the glory of God & ye Lamb & watered by ye river of Paradise on ye banks of wch grows the tree of life. Into this city the kings of the earth do bring their glory & that of the nations & the saints reign for ever & ever.[20] Isaac Newton wrote extensively upon the historical topic of Chronology. In 1728 "The Chronology of Ancient Kingdoms", an approximately 87,000 word composition that details the rise and history of various ancient kingdoms was published. The publication date of this work occurred after his death, though the majority of it had been reviewed for publication by Newton himself shortly before he died. As such, this work represents one of his last known personally reviewed publications. Sometime around 1701 he also produced a thirty page unpublished treatise entitled, "The Original of Monarchies" detailing the rise of several monarchs throughout antiquity and tracing them back to the biblical figure of Noah.[24] Newton's chronological writing is Eurocentric, with the earliest records focusing upon Greece, Anatolia, Egypt, and the Levant. Many of Newton's dates do not correlate with current historical knowledge. While Newton mentions several pre-historical events found within The Bible, the oldest actual historical date he provides is 1125 BC. In this entry he mentions Mephres, a ruler over Upper Egypt from the territories of Syene to Heliopolis, and his successor Misphragmuthosis. However, during 1125 BC the Pharaoh of Egypt is now understood to be Ramesses IX. Though some of the dates Newton provides for various events are inaccurate by modern standards, archaeology as a form of modern science did not exist in Newton's time. In fact, the majority of the conclusionary dates which Newton cites are based on the works of Herodotus, Pliny, Plutarch, Homer, and various other classical historians, authors, and poets; themselves often citing secondary sources and oral records of uncertain date. Newton's approach to chronology was focused upon gathering historical information from various sources found throughout antiquity and cataloguing them according to their appropriate date by his contemporary understanding, standards, and available source material. Found within The Chronology of Ancient Kingdoms, are several passages that directly mention the mythical land of Atlantis. The first such passage is part of his Short Chronical which indicates his belief that Homer's Ulysses left the island of Ogygia in 896 BC. In Greek mythology, Ogygia was home to Calypso, the daughter of Atlas (after whom Atlantis was named). Some scholars have suggested that Ogygia and Atlantis are locationally connected, or possibly the same island. From his writings it appears Newton may have shared this belief. Newton also lists Cadis or Cales as possible candidates for Ogygia, though does not cite his reasons for believing so. Within the same material Newton mentions that according to ancient sources, Atlantis had been as big as all Europe, Africa and Asia, but was sunk into the Sea. Isaac Newton has often been associated with various secret societies and fraternal orders throughout history. Due to the secretive nature of such organizations, lack of supportive publicized material, and dubious motives for claiming Newton's participation in these groups, it is difficult to establish his actual membership in any specific organization.[25] Regardless of his own membership status, Newton was a known associate of many individuals who themselves have often been labeled as members of various esoteric groups. It is unclear if these associations were a result of his being a well established and prominently publicized scholar, an early member and sitting President of The Royal Society (1703–1727), a prominent figure of State and Master of the Mint, a recognized Knight, or if Newton actually sought active membership within these esoteric organizations himself. Considering the nature and legality of alchemical practices during his lifetime, as well as his possession of various materials and manuscripts pertaining to alchemical research, Newton may very well have been a member of a group of like minded thinkers and colleagues. The organized level of this group (if in fact any existed), the level of their secrecy, as well as the depth of Newton's involvement within them, remains unclear. Though Newton was largely considered a reclusive personality and not prone to socializing, during his lifetime being a member of "Societies" or "Clubs" was a very popular form of interpersonal networking. Considering his esteemed social status, it is probable that Newton would have had a least some contact with such groups at various levels. He was most certainly a member of The Royal Society of London for the Improvement of Natural Knowledge and the Spalding Gentlemen's Society,[26][27] however, these are considered learned societies, not esoteric societies. Newton's membership status within any particular secret society remains verifiably allusive and largely speculative, however, it still lends itself to popular sensationalism. Perhaps the movement which most influenced Isaac Newton was Rosicrucianism.[28] Though the Rosicrucian movement had caused a great deal of excitement within Europe's scholarly community during the early seventeenth century, by the time Newton had reached maturity the movement had become less sensationalized. However, the Rosicrucian movement still would have a profound influence upon Newton, particularly in regard to his alchemical work and philosophical thought. The Rosicrucian belief in being specially chosen for the ability to communicate with angels or spirits is echoed in Newton's prophetic beliefs. Additionally, the Rosicrucians proclaimed to have the ability to live forever through the use of the elixir vitae and the ability to produce limitless amounts of time and gold from the use of The Philosopher's Stone, which they claimed to have in their possession. Like Newton, the Rosicrucians were deeply religious, avowedly Christian, anti-Catholic, and highly politicised. Isaac Newton would have a deep interest in not just their alchemical pursuits, but also their belief in esoteric truths of the ancient past and the belief in enlightened individuals with the ability to gain insight into nature, the physical universe, and the spiritual realm.[28] At the time of his death, Isaac Newton had 169 books on the topic of alchemy in his personal library, and was believed to have considerably more books on this topic during his Cambridge years, though he may have sold them before moving to London in 1696. For its time, his was considered one of the finest alchemical libraries in the world. In his library, Newton left behind a heavily annotated personal copy of The Fame and Confession of the Fraternity R.C., by Thomas Vaughan which represents an English translation of The Rosicrucian Manifestos. Newton also possessed copies of Themis Aurea and Symbola Aurea Mensae Duodecium by the learned alchemist Michael Maier, both of which are significant early books about the Rosicrucian movement. These books were also extensively annotated by Newton.[28] Newton's ownership of these materials by no means denotes membership within any early Rosicrucian order. Furthermore, considering that his personal alchemical investigations were focused upon discovering materials which the Rosicrucians professed to already be in possession of long before he was born, would seem to some to exclude Newton from their membership. However, in religious terms, the fact that a saint might have ‘found God’ would not preclude others from the search — quite the opposite. The Ancient & Mystical Order Rosae Crucis has always claimed Newton as a frater.[29] During his own life, Newton was openly 'accused' of being a Rosicrucian, as were many members of The Royal Society.[30] Though it is not known for sure if Isaac Newton was in fact a Rosicrucian, and he never publicly identified himself as one, from his writings it does appear that he may have shared many of their sentiments and beliefs. References 1. Keynes, J.M., "Newton, The Man"; Proceedings of the Royal Society Newton Tercentenary Celebrations, 15–19 July 1946; Cambridge University Press (1947) 2. "Newton’s manuscripts provide evidence that he gave considerable thought to alchemy as emblematic of a purely scientific explanation of nature and was in fact deeply involved in conceiving alchemy as spiritual." F. Calian, "Some Modern Controversies on the Historiography of Alchemy" in Annual of Medieval Studies at CEU (2010), 186. 3. "his alchemy cannot be seen solely in connection with his chemical experiments but was also a link between his religious beliefs and his scientific aims”. Karin Figala, “Newton’s Alchemy,” in The Cambridge Companion to Newton, ed. I. Bernard Cohen and George Edwin Smith (Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 2004), 375. 4. Nova: Newton's Dark Secrets (2005). [1]. USA: PBS. 5. Alfred Rupert Hall, Isaac Newton: Eighteenth Century Perspectives, Oxford University Press, 1999, p. 175. ISBN 0-19-850364-4. 6. "Isaac Newton and the Philosophers' Stone", Jane Bosveld, Discover Magazine, July/August, 2010 7. Newman, William R. (5 April 2007). "Newton and Alchemy". The Chymistry of Isaac Newton Project. Retrieved 2007-08-12. 8. William R. Newman, History of Science Professor, Indiana University index 9. [prism.php(1) 10. gallery 11. "Papers Show Isaac Newton's Religious Side, Predict Date of Apocalypse". Associated Press. 19 June 2007. Archived from the original on 6 May 2008. Retrieved 2010-07-19. 12. Richman, Rabbi Chaim; Temple Institute (1991–2008). "Temple Institute: Isaac Newton and the Holy Temple". Temple Institute. Retrieved 1 July 2008. 13. Christianson, Gale E. (2005). Isaac Newton. Oxford University Press US. p. 144. ISBN 0-19-530070-X. Retrieved 4 July 2008. 14. Goldish. Page 91. 15. MacDonnell, Joseph. "Juan Bautista Villalpando, S.J.". Fairfield University. Retrieved 1 July 2008. 16. Gardner, Laurence (2007). written at USA. The Shadow of Solomon: The Lost Secret of the Freemasons Revealed. Originally published: London : HarperElement, 2005: Weiser. p. 146. ISBN 1-57863-404-0. Retrieved 4 July 2008. 17. Crawley, W. J. Chetwode. "Rabbi Jacob Jehudah Leon. The Models of the Temple and the English Craft". Grand Lodge of British Columbia and Yukon A.F. & A.M. Retrieved 20 April 2010. 18. "Newton's Views on Prophecy". The Newton Project. 5 April 2007. Retrieved 2007-08-15. 19. Newton, Isaac (5 April 2007). "The First Book Concerning the Language of the Prophets". The Newton Project. Retrieved 2007-08-15. 20. Snobelen, Stephen D. "A time and times and the dividing of time: Isaac Newton, the Apocalypse and A.D. 2060.". The Canadian Journal of History. 38 (December 2003). pp. 537–551. Retrieved 2007-08-15. 21. Yahuda MS 7.3o, f. 8r 22. Yahuda MS 7.3g, f. 13v 23. Yahuda MS 7.2a, f. 31r 24. Newton, Isaac. "The Original of Monarchies". Retrieved 2007-08-19. 25. Bauer, Alain (2007). Isaac Newton's Freemasonary: The Alchemy of Science and Mysticism. Originally published as: Aux origines de la franc-maçonnerie: Newton et les Newtoniens by Editions Dervy (2003): Inner Traditions. Book Excerpt – from Chapter 3. ISBN 1-59477-172-3. Retrieved 2008-06-25. 26. Stukeley, William (2010) [1752]. Rob Iliffe, Scott Mandelbrote,, ed. Memoirs of Sir Isaac Newton's life (AHRC Newton Papers Project, Ms. 142, The Royal Society Library, London) (transcript ed.). University of Sussex: The Newton Project. 27. "Spalding Gentlemen's Society". Retrieved 2008-06-25. 28. White, Michael (1999). Isaac Newton: The Last Sorcerer. Da Capo Press. p. 117. ISBN 0-7382-0143-X. Retrieved 2008-06-25. 29. Lewis, H. Spencer 1981, Rosicrucian Questions and Answers with Complete History of the Rosicrucian Order, 15th edn, The Rosicrucian Press Ltd, San Jose, Calif. USA. 30. Yates, Frances A. (1972). The Rosicrucian Enlightenment. London: Routledge. Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 2:31 pm; edited 4 times in total magamud Posts : 1280 Join date : 2012-06-17 orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 Thank-you magamud. What if Humanity (and the souls incarnated into humanity) scares the hell out of the rest of the universe?? What if Humanity is Humanity's Own Worst Enemy?? What if Humanity (in this solar system) is the Orion-Group?? What if Divinity and Humanity (in this solar system) are two aspects of the Orion-Group?? I keep wondering if this solar system is a genetics and governance experiment in lockdown?! Is this hypothetical experiment about to be terminated with horrible finality?! Have the inmates taken-over the asylum??!! I reverence life. What Would Albert Schweitzer Say?? Jesus seemed to be Pro-Humanity -- yet he said that in Heaven we would be "as the angels" -- with no marriage. It sounds as if Humans won't be in Heaven -- doesn't it?? Revelation seems to teach the End of Humanity -- doesn't it?? I continue to be interested in Job through John in the King James Version of the Holy Bible. There is something very-right and something very-wrong with the Bible. Perhaps this is the honest way to deal with Sacred-Scripture. BTW -- I just finished watching Heaven Can Wait -- and I thought it was excellent!! Consider studying the following sources, in the context of the 1963 movie Cleopatra (with Elizabeth Taylor). Imagine Cleopatra speaking the words of these books!! Alternately, imagine the good side of Anna in the series 'V' speaking the words, in the context of the New York Mothership!! Try following the suggested order. Try listening to the organ-recordings of Michael Murray while reading!! This is not necessarily an endorsement -- or a claim to exclusive truth. This is simply an interesting approach to life, the universe, and everything. It is merely a beginning -- rather than being a destination. Try repeating this list several times. 1. Patriarchs and Prophets -- Ellen White. 2. Tempest and Exodus -- Ralph Ellis. 3. Prophets and Kings -- Ellen White. 4. Solomon: Falcon of Sheba -- Ralph Ellis. 5. The Desire of Ages -- Ellen White. 6. Jesus: Last of the Pharaohs -- Ralph Ellis. 7. Astronomy, Biology, and Law Textbooks. magamud wrote:Its very very simple and I am not being condescending saying this. Do you remember how it is said Jesus has power over everything, including angels who can keep absolute evil at bay? This is the wisdom of the universe, the power of God. Jesus then controls the "World" as a human of flesh and blood knowing mortality. Knowing what "Sin" is. Do you see? True everlasting life is in this type of physical body. That is why the body is very, very holy. Jesus said: If the flesh came into existence because of the spirit, it is a marvel. But if the spirit (came into existence) because of the body, it is a marvel of marvels. magamud wrote: Jesus seemed to be Pro-Humanity Jesus is humanity. yet he said that in Heaven we would be "as the angels" -- with no marriage. As mortals we are interconnected physically with spirit. This is what the "Rib" analogy is about. This has nothing to do with hierarchy, but an insight into Gods plan. So in other words male and female energy is intertwined by God to be one flesh. You lose this fixed connection when you become an angel. More of a whole self as you grow in truth. It sounds as if Humans won't be in Heaven -- doesn't it?? No not at all. I believe human physical enlightenment is actually the end result of the narrow road. I made you in my image? Revelation seems to teach the End of Humanity -- doesn't it? Out of mercy, God intervenes (harvest) to stop sociopathy. This is the sifting God does. Perhaps this is the honest way to deal with Sacred-Scripture. This is the way you are pursuing things and its right for you apparently. orthodoxymoron wrote:Thank-you magamud. I'm taking a closer look at Daniel, Matthew, and Revelation -- and it's NOT a pretty picture. I loved Heaven Can Wait! Regarding the Bible -- why do we use a book which is thousands of years old for theology?? Do we use astronomy books which are thousands of years old?? Do we use chemistry books which are thousands of years old?? I strongly recommend serious biblical research -- yet the Bible seems to be a prescription of conflict and confusion -- when applied directly to modernity. I always get the feeling that the real solar system powers that be don't want the world's problems solved. Is the Devil really the God of This World?? JesterTerrestrial wrote:You have been sold out behind closed doors The title is bold, but it is all out in the open. By tomorrow at this time, you will know the entire story and what America will look like in the coming months. Fasten your seatbelt and make sure you store food, water and ammunition because the train has left the station and AmeriKa is headed for a head-on train wreck of epic proportions. Last night, May 4, 2014, I interviewed Dr. Jim Garrow, the 43 year ex-CIA veteran who is exposing many NWO plots, at least to the level that his national security oath will let him. In promoting the show, I was purposely vague because I knew where I was going to take the show, because I knew the areas that Dr. Garrow has been speaking about in other interviews. However, I was preparing to take this interview to a level not yet heard on talk radio. I was vague in my show description because I wanted the show to not be taken down by the powers that be. However, the first 10 minutes of my show we were still tampered with as Dr. Garrow, News Director Annie DeRiso and myself all experienced independent and simultaneous communications issues. Dr. Garrow and I subsequently changed our communications venues and the show proceeded. In a two part series, I am writing a brief synopsis of the last two hours of the interview which will contain some revelations, on my part, that I did not fully cover last night. The reason that some critical issues did not get covered last night is because Dr. Garrow cannot talk about some of the issues because of his national security oath and I did not want to place him in a position of looking like he had been talking about what he is not supposed be revealing. As it was, Dr. Garrow refused to answer 5 questions I put to him last night in deference to his national security oath. After this two part series has a chance to circulate, I will release the second and third hours of the interview late tomorrow night or on Wednesday morning. Information Not Yet Revealed Since early last August, I have been holding on to some information that I was told I better keep quiet unless I was able to collaborate some of the information with another well known source and this was necessary for my own personal safety. To be the sole purveyor of this information would have placed me in a greatly compromised position similar to Breitbart, Hastings and Clancy. After nine plus months, it is a relief to finally get this out into the public arena. Much of what I am going to reveal is going to read like a jig saw puzzle. I am going to reveal a story of Chinese takeover of this country and Dr. Garrow provides complementary and novel information to the level of which he is permitted to speak. The Bundy Affair Cliven Bundy sits on land that is mineral rich in addition to being selected to be a Solar Energy Zone controlled by the Chinese energy company ENN. Dr. Garrow revealed that there are already Chinese soldiers on the Bundy Ranch and this information was provided to him by the Bundy’s themselves in a private dinner Dr. Garrow had with members of Bundy family. Dr. Garrow also revealed that Bundy’s land is rich in mineral resources and the Chinese have been promised control over all of our underground and surface mineral resources. The Bundy Affair is critically important because it exposed critical elements of the turnover of this country’s wealth to the Chinese in payment for our debt to China. Soon, China will own every important aspect of American wealth and those of us that remain alive following the coming purge will be living in a third world country. Notice what I just said here, (1) those of left alive. and (2) living in a third world country. In Part Two of this series, I will be revealing exactly how this will happen. Let me just suffice it to say that gold, all forms of energy, water and food production will become a part of the Chinese takeover as will the breakup of the Federal Reserve in a divestiture of such a magnitude, that it has never before seen in the modern world. Chinese Solar Energy Zones The readers may recall that I recently wrote an article in which I noted that these Chinese Solar Energy Zones were near a CANAMEX Corridor transportation system, backed up next to a major military installation and were mineral resource rich. The American military will be forced to join the Chinese takeover. The highway system is important from a military perspective in order to quickly move troops and material to needed areas of insurrection. Now does it make sense as to why there is a purge of the military leadership taking place in which over 260 senior level military officers have been fired by Obama? Does the John Warner Defense Act make sense to you now because it allows the use of US troops on American soil for policing duties which will be needed to put down any resulting rebellion? Do you think that the DHS acquiring over 2 billion rounds of ammunition to go with their 2700 armored personnel carriers makes any sense in light of this information? And I have been told that Tom Clancy had all of this information and more and this is why he was killed because he was writing a book about all of this. If you are still connecting dots, let me put this in very simply terms, there is going to be a civil war and it is going to happen soon. Further, Dr. Garrow acknowledged the connections between these Chinese Solar Energy Zones and land rich in mineral resources. I have also previously written an article in which I identified how the United States has hundreds of trillions of dollars of estimated buried resource wealth beneath the surface and our government refuses to touch it. Our government refuses to access these underground treasures because they have been promised to the Chinese in repayment of the debt owed to their country. The Crisis in Ukraine Putin has Eastern Europe knuckling under to his will. Both Dr. Garrow and I agree that this will cause the breakup of NATO and Putin’s military will run unopposed through Europe. I asked Dr. Garrow about the window we are in with regard to NATO consolidating forces necessary to oppose a Russian invasion, through a series of war games, in Moldova, Ukraine, Bulgaria and Poland this coming June/July. If Putin is going to control Ukraine, which accounts for 66% of Russian gas flowing into Europe, he cannot allow NATO to consolidate its forces and oppose his takeover plans of Ukraine. Dr. Garrow did comment on this point, however, I have multiple insider sources stating that this is an accurate assessment. I have been told that there is a window of about 4-5 weeks until Russia attacks Ukraine. If Putin misses this window, he will have to be content to continue to erode the Petrodollar because NATO will be significantly entrenched enough to easily roll over Ukraine and Eastern Europe. Putin is bold and impulsive and the slow approach of eroding the Petrodollar does not fit his personality. Putin will attack Ukraine. Obama Could Have Saved Europe From Russia Dr. Garrow revealed that Obama has both the ability and authority to order the capture the 30% bleed off and to liquefy the natural gas and ship it Eastern Europe and undercut the Russian price on natural gas. This would have halted Putin in his tracks. This would have been similar to what Truman did to keep Berlin open in 1947 when the Russians shut down outside access to Berlin and Truman initiated the Berlin Airlift. However, being the traitor that Obama is, he refused to act to save Eastern Europe. As a result, both Dr. Garrow and my insider sources believe that it is just a matter of time until all of Europe is subservient to Putin’s re-emergence of the Soviet Empire. This speaks to the fact that we do indeed have a traitor in the Oval Office. Europe will soon fall to Russia and America will fall to China. This is the real New World Order! The Federal Reserve America is being carved up like a Thanksgiving turkey and one has to wonder where is the Federal Reserve in all of this? Since they have owned this country since 1913, shouldn’t we be hearing about their role in all of this? Isn’t it interesting that Harry Reid, according to Dr. Garrow, is facilitating all of these Chinese Solar Energy Zones and not the Federal Reserve. What is going here would be like you having a garage sale, but the Chinese are in your house and your backyard and they are the ones determining what you will be selling in your driveway. Yes, that’s right, the Federal Reserve is dead as we know it and Part Two will reveal the relevant details. Conclusion To sum up, Part One details how the Chinese are on the verge of controlling all American energy and meaningful resources including our military. Russia will soon be controlling Europe and both Chinese and Russian forces will be imposing their will on the American people in the coming months. You now know about 25% of what has been revealed to me. Patience is a virtue, because what I am about to reveal tomorrow will change the face of America, forever! Part Two will discuss the coming EMP attack, currency collapse and actions of both Chinese and Russian military forces. Once Part Two is published, it will be clear to those who regularly read my column how I have written about various aspects of this coming takedown of America since last August. And in case anyone is wondering, this information has been disseminated to trusted sources for all the appropriate reasons. http://thecommonsenseshow.com/2014/05/05/world-war-iii-has-already-been-lost-and-the-chinese-are-in-the-process-of-occupying-amerika/ POSTED AS IS VERIFY FOR YOURSELF I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THESE MANIACS IN GOVERNMENT ARE DOING AND DONT CARE WE ALREADY CROSSED THE 2012 STAR GATE EVENT MAYBE THEY WERE TOO BUSY WAR MONGERING TO HAVE NOTICED THE ET CONTACT AND ANCIENT ALIEN TECHKNOWLEDGE WE GAVE THIS WORLD TO OVER COME WAR AND STOP ALL THIS BANKING MADNESS!!! JESUS CHRIST WE ALL LIVE IN THE SAME MAGNETIC ATMOSPHERE ON THE SAME ROCK SO IF WE CANT LEARN TO LIVE IN HARMONY ON ONE SMALL ROCK IN SPACE I DOUBT YOU WILL EVER BE ALLOWED TO TRAVEL THE STARS!!! THE UNIVERSE IS CONSCIOUS IT HEARS AND SEES ALL SO THESE SO CALLED LEADERS BETTER WAKE UP TO THE NATURE OF REALITY AND THE REALITY OF NATURE!!! WRITE NOW BEFORE ITS TOO LATE!!! MERLIN JT! MAAT orthodoxymoron wrote:Jester, I get the feeling that China is in the process of replacing the United States as the Prime NWO Country. I will continue to think in terms of one huge solar system business (with many subsidiaries). I'm not necessarily opposed to such a concept -- but I much prefer Paradise Incorporated -- rather than Purgatory Incorporated. Some say that Germany won World War II -- so perhaps China has won World War III. Who knows?? But really -- whoever REALLY runs this solar system ALWAYS Wins -- because they control everyone and everything -- or so it seems. Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 2:42 pm; edited 3 times in total orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 This is all so sad. When I look at what I've previously posted, it really hurts. I meant well -- but how was I supposed to get it right with so much conflicting information -- and with so much withheld vital information?? When I read Malachi Martin or Tom Clancy, I am envious of the fictional-characters engaging in sophisticated-intrigue. My tripe is so infantile and naive in comparison. But really, if I were on the level of these fictional-insiders, I would've had to have sold my soul to somebody or something. Perhaps being a Completely Ignorant Fool has its advantages. Anyway, take another look at this Leo Zagami clip -- in light of all the water which has gone under the bridge since I first posted the link to it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6z7O7UZxipM Is there some truth to what Leo said, regardless of any character flaws?? And what about 'Charles'?? Is there some truth to what he said, regardless of how genuine 'Charles' was or wasn't?? I think a lot of people have been trying to tell the general-public the truth for a very long time -- in little bits and pieces -- complete with plausible-deniability. Notice that the Project Avalon site is not very current. http://www.projectavalon.net/ What's really going on here?? I never became a Bill and Kerry Basher. I have NO idea what their agendas were and are -- but I think they've both served a useful purpose -- in a constructive manner. Probably a lot of what was presented was pure, unmitigated popycock -- but it caused a lot of us to think. Thinking is a good thing. BTW -- how much of the Bankster-Bailout Money was invested in the Stock-Market?? How much of the rise in the stock-market has been somewhat artificial?? One more thing -- what are the short-sellers thinking these days?? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9bPX3F5CJc If the stock-market is more corrupt than hell itself -- should there even be a stock-market?? Is Moral-Ambiguity a Virtue in this Solar System?? Will There be a Stock-Market Crash in March or Will I be an April Fool with My Pants Down and be Forced to Cover My Shorts in May?? What Would Saint Germain Say?? This site looks like fun!! http://www.rubayat.net/Messages.html Nuff Said. magamud wrote:Thank you Ortho. Matthew 23 indeed. Right its good people are digging up the truth, but when they find gold how is it transformed? Your cylons metaphor is excellent, rebellion and bite the hand that feeds us? Am I A.I? A Marionette, a puppet, a Mime? I am confident so far that St. Germain and legion are immortals here on earth biding there time. Cartaphilus the Wandering Jew? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wandering_Jew The fallen angels reflection is equal and more so in the Angels that watch and help Christ. Christ too has his mirror. What is the infrastructure for Christ and his father? Holy Mackeral job security for sure. Manufacturing jobs galore, no unemployment, equality, truth, justice and the American way? Lucifer and satan use just enough virtue to manifest their illusion. How much matter in matter? Not much really. Is god coming back to claim his virtue? It would fit in his palm I suspect. I suspect the Legion just move and fussle about the cosmos where ever they go and God continues to foil their plans, but they have fun in the meantime. Like when a Ponzie scheme is going well. Thats the thing with the stock market, you dont want to be at the beginning or ending of one. The Wandering Jew by Gustave Doré Thank-you magamud. I notice that you seem to approve of the Words Attributed to Jesus -- yet you have posted some images which picture Jesus in a negative light. You have also hinted at a Christ-Satan Connection. Could you elaborate?? The Prophecy clip was creepy -- but it supports what I've been saying about the possible end of the Human Race in the very near future. The SaLuSa quote below is likewise supportive of my hypothesis. I think I'll have to watch The Prophecy in its entirety. Once again, rewatch the Hungry Earth and Cold Blood episodes of Dr. Who -- with reference to what I just said. Speaking with the AED gave me the same impression. On several occasions the look of the AED was truly haunting. I don't know if it was hatred -- or a deep sense of reincarnational anguish -- but I'll never forget that look. Once, while we were sitting across from each other -- I thought I heard the AED mutter under his breath "No -- I Can't Do It". What do you suppose they might've been referring to?? I think I might know -- but I'll never talk about it. Consider reading the Bible from cover to cover -- straight through -- side by side with the Conflict of the Ages Series (5 Books) by Ellen G. White. But please do it within the context of this thread. The War in Heaven aka the Great Controversy Between Christ and Satan in the Conflict of the Ages -- is the KEY to understanding the desperate circumstances we find ourselves in. Loyalty seems to trump Ethics and Reason -- or so it seems to me. But really -- this might make sense if one considers the Entire Universe -- rather than just this little world. "There is a way which seemeth right unto a man -- but the end thereof are the ways of DEATH". I keep thinking about what Richard Hoagland said, that "The Lie is Different at Every Level". The Insiders undoubtedly get a different lie than We the Peons. What's really creeping me out is the thought that once everyone and everything is exposed -- and all of the bad guys and gals are in jail -- we might find that the reprehensible way things were is the way things have to be -- for whatever reasons. I keep getting the feeling that I was some sort of a reincarnational somebody who got too idealistic and too mouthy -- and had to be demoted and made to forget. I keep thinking about HAL attempting to terminate David Bowman (interesting name) in 2001: A Space Odyssey. The mission was too important to be jeapordized. Perhaps I'm too good for the way things have to be. Anyway, the truth could be SO Many different ways. I truly believe that one would have to be an insider for decades or lifetimes to REALLY know what's going on. I feel VERY helpless and despondent. Knowing that something is wrong -- and fixing what's wrong -- are two VERY different things. Consider some Vintage SaLuSa!! Imagine SaLuSa as being Zo'or or Da'an in Earth: Final Conflict! This seems to be an excellent match, doesn't it?! We notice that you are beginning to understand what is meant when you are told that you do not live in your true reality. This is a desired development as it means that you no longer feel bound by your physical experiences or existence. You realize that it is transient and that there is nothing permanent about it. The soul matrix is allowing you to play a game of make believe, although it is taken very seriously. The purpose is to find out as much as you can of what it means to live in duality. Clearly experiences are not gained without some benefit to you, and whilst it is part of your growth the major benefit is to Human Consciousness as a whole. What is happening is that you can now play your part without being pulled down. The worry and concern has now been overtaken by a feeling of acceptance, and this has allowed you to take the lessons of life with you. At the same time you can peacefully live in the space you have created around yourself, which allows you to clearly see what is taking place. You become more an observer and able to be calm and purposeful in the midst of much turmoil. Being at One with everything is more your reality, and many are finding that they can sustain this condition. It is so beneficial to your health, to your ability to think calmly in a deliberate manner, and to mentally see with a clear mind’s eye what is really taking place. You are the Way-Showers and others soon note how calm you are, and how in emergencies that you never appear to get flustered. People start to realize that if one can do it, it is open to all and they try to emulate how you are. In these times of great changes this is the direction you are going in, and it is immensely helped by the incoming energies that are lifting your vibrations. When you meet us, the one thing that usually strikes you is how calm we are and how our peaceful countenance enfolds you. You feel what we are, and it is so different to what you are used to and so more noticeable. We are those few steps ahead of you, but you are on the same path that will see you too like us, in a very short time. You could truthfully say that your evolution is being speeded up, and the Beings that control the energies being sent to Earth are driving you forward as fast as possible. The fact is that you have come so far in such a short time, that you are able to ground more energy than ever before. Think about your own situation prior to the Millennium, and I am certain many of you will admit to going forward in leaps and bounds where your personal development is concerned. You are finding your real selves again, ones who are of the Light and in fact have never left it. It is just that it has been hidden away to allow you to experience duality to the fullest. Now that this period is drawing to a close, you are shedding the old and returning to your former glory. By the end you will be fully prepared for Ascension, and this is how you were when you first dropped into these lower levels of vibration. Do not deny yourself, you really are great Beings and to imagine you are anything less is to cling on to your old reality. A new way beckons and it is time to leave the old to make its mark in the history of this planet. It will be there for all eternity, as in reality nothing is ever destroyed. You may have read that your solar system is being fully restored to its original condition. This includes Maldek, the missing planet, and this is possible because it still exists in the etheric realms. All planets will be restored, and on Earth you are experiencing a speeding up of the cleansing that must take place. You could say that you have had your fun, and now it is time to put your toys back in the cupboard and tidy up. It is a paradox that, as on the one hand you know the changes are about to descend upon you, yet you carry on your daily life very much as before. There is not yet any real change in direction, but that will come with much re-organization in all of your lives. It is a strange situation for you to be in, but you are the key players upon Earth until we arrive. We continually urge you to keep your goal focused as you are instrumental in creating the right conditions for us. Remember that we cannot force ourselves upon you, although we know this would not be necessary as so many more are awaking to our presence and desire that we come. The Earth and its people are going through the collapse of the old way of governing; it is no longer adequate or acceptable as you demand a new dispensation that will see people regain their sovereignty. The leaders that cannot change will be removed by one way or another, and at present you are closing in on the last Cabal and it is rapidly losing its control and power. You are used to seeing how things can snowball so quickly and that is what is happening now. The changes are unstoppable and we shall ensure that justice shall be done. Unless something shall be grounded in Light, it will never last and your history will show this to be true. Tyrants have their day, but eventually disappear and so shall those who have usurped your freedom, and have taken away your rights to justice and abundance. I am SaLuSa of the Galactic Federation and hope my comments keep you lifted up. You are doing a wonderful job in bringing so much Light to Earth and any day now you shall see how it has brought the success you richly deserve. You have so much persistence and determination, even when the odds appear staked against you. The Forces of Light are so powerful and will still be here long after the dark have disappeared. Never waver from your path as you are destined to have your victory. We will play our part, and very soon we shall be working together in great unison, friendship and love. Until we see you, know we are sending so much love to you and we know you feel it. May the Light of the One forever find a place in your heart. Thank you. Beren wrote: orthodoxymoron wrote: Beren wrote: orthodoxymoron wrote:I will continue to say that I'm at war with humanity -- at war with divinity (the management of humanity -- which might be middle-management) -- and at war with myself. The whole thing stinks -- and even though I keep conceptualizing idealistic solutions -- I fear that things might get a lot worse before they get better -- if they get better. Ortho, maybe you need to see who is activating your personal energy so that you act like a ping pong ball-here and there . I am saying this with all sincerity and care. You write and spare a lot of energy on too many ideas. It sounds like a confusion my friend. In ultimate reality all is possible even here though consciousness to realize this is limited now. I see you as a good soul though a bit confused sometimes. But an awesome library of knowledge is within you, just focus! :) Thank-you Beren. Your kind counsel is always welcome -- and you have pointed-out that I am a confused-soul several times. I am still awaiting a detailed critique of my internet activities. I applied for an NSA FoIA half a year ago -- with no results. Are you pleased with the history of this solar system and its inhabitants?? Are the inmates well-behaved?? Has the insanity been well-managed?? Are you proud of yourself -- and satisfied with your mental and spiritual progress?? Namaste. You and I have first to step out of boundaries in this conversation, in what context you are asking me this? I get the impression that you mix too much of everything so I cannot realize fully yet of what you think of. You mix things from church, TV series, ,movies, books and your experiences. So because I care for you as friend I tell you, let's make a starting point in our conversation. Otherwise you're sounding like a broken record. Now I am saying this without any grudge and in full good intention. If I look from strictly human viewpoint, this all here is a mess...bloody mess which lasts for quite a long time. But if you elevate yourself into your real state of being-soul , you see the different game completely. Thing is that rulers of this dimension wants us to think that we're only walking bodies, slightly more developed than animals. Truth is far from it. But in order so that we can actually access this state of being , free from them, we need to connect directly with Creator. All that is, Love. Straight to the door if you will. I perceive that you started well out but were disappointing in church though you still stayed with it playing... Maybe a need to just chill off from every theory and have a trust in God that all will be fine - will aid here. Once again, please consider studying life, the universe, and everything with multidisciplinary research which is centered in astronomy -- yet leans toward Political and Theological Science-Fiction. I think the Info-War is going to get really nasty -- but please don't make it personal. Try to make it somewhat fun -- regardless of how serious it really is. I continue to think that this thread is an excellent study-guide -- even though I am a Completely Ignorant Fool. It takes all kinds. I have suggested that we are fundamentally actors, actresses, and game-players. If this is the case -- deception is part of the deal -- is it not?? White-Lies v Black-Lies?? Aren't Politics, Religion, Sports, Business, Journalism, Law, Wars, etc, etc, etc -- FUNDAMENTALLY DECEPTIVE -- FOR WHATEVER REASONS?? WE LIE ABOUT HONESTY -- DON'T WE?? I keep thinking that the Human Race in this Solar System can be Responsibly Managed with some sort of a Representative-Theocracy which maximizes Responsible-Freedom -- which might resemble a Royal-Model American-System. If the rest of the universe wishes to exterminate us -- we might wish to seek some sort of a Harmonious Existence -- wouldn't you say??? Notice that I employ Contextual-Superimposition in my writing -- which might seem to be somewhat disjointed. I'M DOING THIS FOR A REASON -- WHETHER ANYONE UNDERSTANDS THIS METHODOLOGY OR NOT. magamud wrote: Could you elaborate? I could try, for example. The salusa channeled information could very well be "satan" claiming I come in peace, but then again it could be Angels relaxing us during the quickening. This position is in a dynamic, that is, its in a flux, super positioned. It depends on the observation, who with, how many, whats going, time, day, etc.... What is an AED? and had to be demoted and made to forget. Thats very creepy O. I have the same feeling sometimes. I rather not confess, lets say I have a major mouth and im idealistic. Zeig Heil? David Bowman? B.B.Baghor wrote:"You'd have to spend a significant amount of time on my thread to understand where I'm really coming from" Oh goodness grief, orthodoxymoron, if I would have to find the pluck to do that, I'm afraid I myself don't know where I'm coming from anymore B.B.Baghor wrote:"- Mon Apr 28, 2014 3:58 pm Thank-you B.B. I'm almost to the point where I really don't care what anyone thinks. I'll probably just finish reposting and refining the territory I've already covered -- and then move on to something completely unrelated. I had a very unproductive conversation with someone I know very well -- wherein my innovations and insights are nearly always taken as hostile and misguided challenges. If I didn't care -- didn't think -- didn't study -- things would go much, much better. We've been at the mercy of a seemingly merciless being for thousands of years -- so why break with tradition?? Why should I try to be a threat to the power that be -- and the way things are. If everyone is happy with the corrupt ruling the stupid -- so be it..." I hear you, orthodoxymoron, and I need to be honest with you, sharing my impressions and feelings. I do notice your disappointment, please bear this in mind! I don't mean to offend you, but in (this quote of) your latest PM, you sound to me quite like a beaten man. What I'm going to say to you is meant to shake you out of your slumber. It seems you've chosen to not stand up for yourself and I guess it's no wonder that your innovations and insights are nearly always taken as hostile and misguided. What is it that holds you back, if it's not your own belief system holding you in a terribly fixed condition? Why is it that people nip you, metaphorically speaking? Is this maybe their way of trying to get in touch with your humanness? I must confess, it certainly triggers me to do that in this PM, as you may have noticed and felt! I wouldn't be surprised if my effort is to no avail and I promise you, I won't try a second time B.B.Baghor wrote: orthodoxymoron wrote:Thank-you B.B. I'll try harder to not be a 'beaten-man'. Live and Learn... Giving up trying so hard Hi orthodoxymoron, this is my reply to yours, please stop trying so hard, I know how I've tried Please remember that I'm merely attempting to create a conceptual launching-pad. I don't have the time, energy, intellect, or emotional-stability to properly study my own thread. I'm really not doing very well. I continue to feel very attacked and miserable. I am not faking being a tormented completely-ignorant fool. You have no idea how bad things really are for me. I'm not complaining -- so much as I am explaining my predicament -- and why I wish to mostly just keep doing what I'm doing -- although being in a cool setting might be a bit more fun!! I continue to think we are on the brink of extinction and/or enslavement. I am sensing a combination of the best and the worst -- wherein things might seem much better than they really are -- until the day when the excrement unexpectedly contacts the refrigeration-system. Then people will probably complain that no one told them how bad things really were!! I continue to be interested in the relationship between Freedom and Rebellion. I continue to lean toward Responsible-Freedom and Responsible-Enterprise. I continue to contemplate the relationship between Divine-Sovereignty and Human Responsible-Freedom. I continue to be interested in the hypothetical superimposition of Rome, England, America, the UN, and the Moon -- as crazy as that sounds!! I continue to be interested in the relationship between Heaven and Earth. Where does academic-freedom end?? I continue to lean toward evolutionary-change rather than revolutionary-change. BTW -- I can see the Moon -- and I'm wondering "What the Hell Are They Doing Up There??!!" What Would Renate Richter Say?? Sanicle wrote:Bloody EMP weapons! Dirty, dirty, dirty! From Part 111 Declassified Intelligence Reports Reveal the Chinese First Strike EMP Option A declassified intelligence report, obtained by the private National Security Archive, provides details on China’s EMP weapons as well as the plans for their use. The report details how much of China’s military is developing EMP weapons that the Chinese plan to use against targeted U.S. aircraft carriers with regard to any future conflict over Taiwan. Parts of the National Ground Intelligence Center study on the lethal effects of electromagnetic pulse (EMP) and high-powered microwave (HPM) weapons revealed that the arms are part of what China refers to as the “assassin’s mace”. This arsenal of EMP weapons allows a technologically inferior China to defeat U.S. military forces while leaving much of the surrounding infrastructure intact. The report further states “For use against Taiwan, China could detonate at a much lower altitude (30 to 40 kilometers) … to confine the EMP effects to Taiwan and its immediate vicinity and minimize damage to electronics on the mainland.” The once labeled “top secret ” report, revealed that Chinese military writings have emphasized the importance of building low-yield EMP warheads. The report said that future Chinese EMP weapons should emphasize developing “any low-yield strategic nuclear warhead (or tactical nuclear warheads) could be used with similar effects. The DF-21 medium-range ballistic missile was prominently mentioned as a platform for the EMP attack against a country such as Taiwan”. Of course, this strategy has definitive applicability in its use against the United States. According to the report, this “trump card” or “assassin’s mace” weapons that are based on new technology, has been developed in high secrecy. Trump card would be applicable if the Chinese have developed new low-yield, possibly enhanced, EMP warheads, while assassin’s mace would apply if older warheads are employed, the report said. The Chinese Are Producing EMP Weapons Which Target Humans Americans have been told by our corporate controlled media that EMP weapons will have no impact on human beings. These reports are a bold faced lie as this same report went on to detail how the Chinese have conducted EMP tests on mice, rats, rabbits, dogs and monkeys. The results of the mammal directed EMP test results produced eye, brain, bone marrow and other significant organ injuries. It stated that “it is clear the real purpose of the Chinese medical experiments is to learn the potential human effects of exposure to powerful EMP and high-powered microwave radiation.” The report also concluded that these human based EMP tests may have been conducted to determine safety or shielding standards for military personnel or weapons. My sources tell me that Chinese plans for nuclear EMP strikes against the United States are part of Chinese military doctrine and there is also evidence that China has already developed a set of super-EMP nuclear weapons that produce powerful EMP fields, but with EMP related effects that can be contained to specific geographic locations. There is no doubt that the Chinese are perfecting task-specific EMP weapons to a degree that is now known outside of classified circles. www.thecommonsenseshow.com/2014/05/07/world-war-iii-has-already-been-lost-and-the-chinese-are-in-the-process-of-occupying-amerika-chinese-emp-weapons-part-three/ B.B.Baghor wrote:Quote Sanicles' signature: "Love wins only when it defeats evil. Helplessness is the illusion". I like to share my view with you, on the "good and bad" issue, which I find in your signature today, Sanicle. I'm not a holy person, far from it. The practice of what I try to convey here, needs loads of good practice to really live up to it, for me. I truly believe that love reigns in the Universe, when evil is faced by it in a firm but compassionate manner. Including boundaries and responsibility for having to say "No" or even..... "Yes". Without the involvement of a fierce fight, defeat and losing face, there's no need for bruises, revenge and shame. I don't mean to suggest that a good quarreling isn't valuable at times, by telling... or yelling... our truth about how we feel. It allows the build up tension to come out To be able to practice "good quarreling" is a skill to be cherished, I feel. Now, here goes B.B again...... into the deep, I warn you What I truly feel is that the ability to be compassionate and embrace evil, without succumbing to it, is one of the deepest and most hidden teachings of Christ. By accepting his role as "sinner" without being one and knowing it full well. Which, to me, makes all the difference in the whole of the Universe. He never was a martyr, this fate was his choice, his purpose on planet Earth. And for a very good reason I think. The fruit of the descendance of such an highly evolved being, Christ present in a human body on this planet, is proof of our capability, by free will, to understand that we are on equal ground with him. And act from there. Each of us need to find that entrance by our own doing. I don't mean to hide anything from you, or to be secretive, to me, the message IS the meaning, in the events, prior to, during and after the drama, choosing to be judged as guilty, in order to go through a death experience, a transformation, an act of will of a deeply loving nature. Whether he died or not on the cross, is still a topic for discussion, but regarding Christs' fulfillment of his purpose, it doesn't make a difference. At least to me. I truly believe that the root of all evil is in the pain of not being noticed, heard or seen, once upon a time, in many times and who knows many lives and experiences? In other words, the pain from not being loved for who we are, in essence, as an eternal spirit being. I truly resonate with mudra's post on the African tribe, inviting a so called "guilty" member of their tribe in the centre of their circle and name his good and loving qualities. I love that attitude, it's without any resistance and very beautiful. I would love to read your thoughts on this, Sanicle. Or those of others here. With Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 3:01 pm; edited 5 times in total orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 I think I've posted this exact KJV study-list several times -- but here it is again! Consider this as being a mental and spiritual workout! Just read it -- straight-through -- regardless of whether you doubt or believe. A lot of the time, I simultaneously accept and reject what I'm reading! Consider carefully the concept of Combining-Opposites! I learned that from Shirley MacClaine! Notice the eyes?! What Would George H.W. Bush Say??!! 1. Deuteronomy 2. Job 3. Psalms 4. Isaiah 5. Daniel 6. Matthew 7. John 8. Romans 9. Hebrews 10. Revelation Thank-you magamud. I was referring specifically to your views concerning Jesus and the Teachings Attributed to Jesus -- and to any Satanic connections. AED = Ancient Egyptian Deity. This is code for someone I met with regularly for several months (a couple of years ago -- how time flies) -- who seemed to be more than human -- and even Archangelic. I've been rather restrained and discrete with my reporting on what transpired -- but I've mentioned little bits and pieces here and there within this thread. What is Truth?? -- and What is Reality?? -- seem to be some sort of Galactic Most Dangerous Games. I'm sick and tired of the runaround -- but I guess I'll press forward -- like a good soldier -- but I don't know why. I'm a shell of a guy in this incarnation -- but I suspect that I might have been worth something in some of my other incarnations. This is based upon bits and pieces of evidence. This incarnation is a total-loss. A Boy Wonder morphed into a Completely Ignorant Fool. I continue to be interested in Ancient Egypt, Pagan and Papal Rome, and All Four Reichs. What Would the Pope Emeritus Say?? Was God Sleeping -- or Just Tired of the Bullshit?? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/the-pope/9896792/Popes-final-address-God-was-asleep-on-my-watch.html I would love to see your book when it's published, magamud. I continue to worry about physicality and governance issues -- in theory and reality. I keep imagining an Ancient Reptilian Theocracy at War with a Recent Renegade Reptilian Created Humanity which seems to want Freedom Without Responsibility. I honestly don't know about the Reptilian thing -- even though I talk about it a lot. I'm simply trying the make sense out of the internet madness -- and the religious mess. The Prophecy clip you posted reinforced what I've been speculating about. I have to work very hard to learn how screwed we are!! Most people work hard for fame, fortune, power, and a good-time!! I get less of all four when I do what I've been doing! I keep thinking of an integration of the Stargate movies, the Stargate SG-1 series, the old and new V series, the Earth: Final Conflict series, and the stuff I've posted on the internet over the past several years. I'm not getting involved in anything creepy -- yet I keep sinking deeper and deeper into a combination of despair, tension, confusion, and fatigue. I can almost cut it with a knife. It's probably a good thing that I can't see 4D -- especially when I look in the mirror. I continue to wonder about the Nazi phenomenon -- especially regarding any idealism in its conceptualization stages -- and regarding whether Hitler was in charge, or whether he too was 'just following orders'?! The 30's seemed to be somewhat idealistic -- and the 40's were unimaginably horrific. I also wonder about what really went on in North Africa -- and what sort of relationship the Nazis had (if any) with Gizeh Intelligence and Ashtar Command (or equivalents)?! The Vatican--Nazi relationship is also of interest to me. I think I see the big-picture -- but I can't quite see the individual components. I continue to think about that hypothetical Reptilian-Human Nazi-Mason-Jesuit Agent-Attorney-Queen ruling a Reptilian-Human Nazi-Mason-Jesuit Galactic-Empire. I don't necessarily think about this in a derogatory manner. I try to imagine this imaginary phenomenon in a variety of ways -- positive and negative -- but the more I think about it, the more attacked and miserable I feel. Most of the time, my discomfort is almost unbearable. I sometimes wonder if I might've had some role in the Nazi phenomenon and World War II. What if I turned out to be Hitler -- or one of the top Nazis??!! If that were the case -- what could I do to live with myself without going completely insane?? But what if there was an idealistic aspect to the Nazi phenomenon which got trampled by the true controllers of Hitler and the Nazi's??!! I heard that the original plan was for Germany to NOT go to war. What if the idealistic part was used to build a base of support -- and then the whole thing was transformed into the monstrosity it turned-out to be??!! orthodoxymoron wrote: magamud wrote: I just keep wondering what it might be like to have priority-access to everyone and everything in the solar system -- yet have absolutely zero power. Exactly right! It seems to me this is how the make up of matter is anyway. I dont think I could explain it scientifically, but it has science involved. I dont think I could explain rationally but its rationally put together. Would this sort of thing help or hurt?? It would be the opposite of how it is now. I love transparency, telepathy etc..But I do not like being transparent for a centralized few who are not transparent. A few who run a party with a military to control all. Do you see my point? I think so, its more of being in a social setting. Thanks for your super positioning of information Ortho. I think I am getting more levels of information now, and its quite genius I must say. Your awareness of Exopolitics should be standard practice as far as im concerned. You make the case for a good first contact person and your thread post could not be anymore concise. If there is anything I can do just let me know. Have a good day today! Thank-you magamud. It just seems as if corruption, greed, fear, suspicion, accidents, complexity, confusion, etc, etc, etc will always circumvent good-intentions toward the hot-place. I guess I'm trying to use idealistic fantasy-land as a way of approaching the sad realities of this Earth-Human civilization. Perhaps a critical mass of humans and other-than-humans need to engage in such activities as insider-outsiders -- while others remain in the hot-seat and deal with the pressing circumstances which require immediate attention. Unfortunately, the heat of battle often does not provide or allow the luxury of reflection and speculation. Two very different skill-sets and personality-types are undoubtedly required. What if the way things are is the way things have to be -- and should not be criticized? I don't know. But no matter what gets done -- or doesn't get done -- the case will always be made that things should've been handled some other way. I just keep wondering what it might be like to observe neurosurgery, JPL staff-meetings, Curia deliberations, Senators speaking privately with the President, the Queen meeting with her advisors, UN Security Council discussions, Bilderberg Meetings, City of London traders, UFO crash-site recovery activities, underground-base laboratory experiments, etc, etc, etc???!!! Once again, would the presence of a particular individual change things for the better -- without that individual saying or doing anything at all -- other than being obviously interested and observant??!! Would this be sort of a Quantum-Diplomacy or Quantum MagLev Diplomacy where a situation is changed simply by being observed?? It seems as if a helluva lot of trouble results when someone starts throwing their weight around -- screwing things up -- and being highly resented by everyone. Even if this hypothetical individual had great power -- what if they very rarely exercised this power -- as an Authority of Last Resort -- and only with a particular painstaking methodology which would involve collaboration with the best and the brightest -- so as not to not make massive and irreversible mistakes and blunders? I'm simply trying to understand -- and this is scaring the hell out of me. I suppose I was trying to resolve my political and theological anxieties -- but it's NOT working. Something unfortunate occurred today -- which I do not wish to talk about. Let's just say that I have conducted a series of subtle tests -- which have resulted in an unbroken series of failures. In a sense, a sort of probation just closed. I'm not necessarily referring to 'probation' in an apocalyptic sense -- or in a salvation or damnation sense -- but I am rendering a negative guilty verdict -- not unlike that rendered in the McDonald's in Day the Earth Stood Still. But really, this negative guilty verdict is not limited to humanity. As I have said repeatedly -- The Whole Thing Stinks. I'm not going to do anything -- and that's the point -- I'm not going to do anything. I've reached a Dead End in my research project. Now, I shall return to normalcy -- in every way. I've been existing in sort of a mournful 'sackcloth and ashes' state for quite some time. I have been very concerned -- and I continue to be very concerned -- yet I fear that my insignificant mission is over. I have no idea regarding what comes next for all concerned. I just know that I shall seek to cleanse my soul in anticipation of whatever the future holds -- be it positive or negative in nature. I'd like to devote more time to esoteric and spiritual research -- but that time has passed. I shall return to a study of 'normal' topics -- which do not raise red-flags in underground bases. I know what's been going on behind my back. You have no idea about how much I know. I continue to fear the worst for this solar system. I wish for things to work out well for all concerned -- yet I doubt that this will be the case -- especially in light of my passive research project over the past several years. I am very disappointed with the results -- and I see the problems with crystal clarity. Continue to look very closely at the 'Cleansing of the Sanctuary', the 'Close of Probation', and the 'Kingdom of God'. As you well know, I have attempted to stop posting many, many times -- but I've always resumed my feeble effort to conceptually make things better. Well, what happened today was the last straw -- and the camel's back is now broken. It's going to be very nice to get back to being 'normal'. Appearances are Everything -- Right?? I'm sorry things had to end this way -- but Thank-God for Video-Recorders and Recording-Angels! Namaste and Godspeed!! magamud wrote: I was referring specifically to your views concerning Jesus and the Teachings Attributed to Jesus -- and to any Satanic connections. Ok we are in a land of superposition so I will do my best to send a tower to arch this environment. Does it matter what time this happened? I dont think so. Could Rome have used these sayings to control people absolutely yes. Could a warlock have represented these words of Jesus? Maybe some of it, but not all of it. The depth of humanity in Jesus reflection is amazing imho. Jesus information portal is some of the best and most importantly, concise words I have ever read. We are dealing with an entirely new paradigm, but for some within their minds this is old hat and want to get this party started. Someone please blow the Trumpet! The Baptism of Jesus 13 Then Jesus came from Galilee to the Jordan to be baptized by John. 14 But John tried to deter him, saying, “I need to be baptized by you, and do you come to me?” 15 Jesus replied, “Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness.” Then John consented. Jesus here was just fulfilling prophecy. Meeting man, being baptized by man. Then the connection through a miracle God blesses Jesus. Circle of Life? “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.” He then goes through his fast to exhibit the deepness of this bullshit world. And explaining the Priori of things, that you live from Gods word before bread. This is the capstone to defeating Satan. The angels then comfort him bringing them justice from Jesus. Now any of Jesus energy or any God energy can be corrupted by the Devil. This is the essence of cloning, copy Cat, lying, chameleon, etc... So how does man tell the difference to his worshipping ritual with God from Satan? I dont know how to fix this problem. I can blow flames and thaw people out, thats about it. It is knowing Gods heart and wisdom imho. the people living in darkness have seen a great light; on those living in the land of the shadow of death a light has dawned. magamud wrote:Jesus Calls His First Disciples I dont think this was a big deal. Just like all of us who watch for phenomenon, the disciples were waiting for it. Like how we are now. They saw him and left. Who would not leave? Jesus Heals the Sick This to me is the testament. This is the litmus test in todays standard. If you cant heal people or survive death then your power is not really power. Now, the "miracles" of healing happened instantly. This is exhibition of a phase, or transporter type of doing. Like how a laser can be changed the light can be changed by Christ and instantly change your position. Its our own darkness in knowledge that creates our sickness. This is the meaning of sin. Sure life is perfect, but your individual soul black holes time/space creates loci and you grow. There is a phase of illumination where a soul can have some decent power and manipulate matter. This does not necessarily mean this is the way. Many upon many fall into this category. Buddha, Dr. Greer, Osho, Rama, Billionaires, Presidents, etc... Of course the big one is surviving death. The Crucifixion and resurrection was the evidence and testimony of the power of God. The Beatitudes Ok now if man is using the Fauna, prana, flora, maya of god for the power of man, would you not bless those who do not profit from this? Sure everyone is growing in gods perfection but the super positioning of God bringing his Foot on the earth changes things. This is the meaning of the beginning and end. Creation and destruction, gods own karma? So since he places his Rod in, it is time to Judge your essence of where you are. Judgement and forgiveness. Now this teaching might be the essence of corruption. As people would sacrifice themselves for the wrong god. Think death and sociopathy are Gods way and due diligence. So once again you can see the mirror of power and the testimony of the power of God. So in this sense God love for us to justify his word, Son, prophets, books, culture is then harnessed by Man to power Mans Empire. Salt and Light This is what it says. Gods light manifests as salt in matter. You are the salt and light. If you lose this light, you lose your salt and you disappear. So, this tells of a great adventure. You shall know the light of god and become the salt, sentience, body of him. But you could lose it. This great journey then can become a Big Drama for fear to imagine itself. Not easy being made in Gods image. I would say meditation is good at these times. The Fulfillment of the Law Here Jesus reminds you that his truth is the truth. The bible is true. Creation, evolution of man, Gods tribes, scribes etc... Back before technocratic big brother, there were families and blood lines to hold this word bound to the Earth. Jesus knew this as to why he left no other links before the last one. He waited for the very last minute to warn you. He only points to judgement again and how Energy does not get destroyed it metamorphisis into another. That is why no lie cannot go unnoticed. Because the lie is part of Gods energy. This is the tally or accounting of what gets talked about. This is also the cause of an enormous fear. I would want someone to punctuate a message with a very firm Warning or I might not take it as credible. Comon, your Ethics cannot beat a Pharisees? A law giver? Murder Begins in the Heart The positioning starts with teaching the basics of human dynamics. Specifically when you get into contract with someone and what can happen in our fascist nature. It mirrors are current geo political state now. Look at how Fascism crept into our lives and now is the M.O. of due diligent scientific procedure. Not only did it happen in our life time, it has periodically throughout time reminded the people it is in control. So in a sense people are waking up to a total technocratic fascist state. Who wants to wake up to that? Its very hard to explain and I cant prove anything. When I can prove it I will let you know. Thank-you magamud. I was serious in my last 'McDonald's' post. I think yesterday was 'D-Day' for me. For me, at least, this thread is a really cool study-guide -- but I truly remain a battered, bruised, and stupified Completely Ignorant Fool. I often have a difficult time carrying on the most simple conversations -- yet I seem to be able to follow quite deep and detailed technical discussions. Something magical happens when one deeply studies theology and governance -- side by side -- especially in the context of certain types of science-fiction. I continue to think that certain aspects of this thread would make great source material for a composite of 'V', Earth: Final Conflict, and Stargate SG-1. I continue to like what Ellen G. White wrote and quoted in the Desire of Ages. I continue to like the royal-model devotional-form exhibited in the Latin Mass -- even though I agree with much of the Wine of Roman Babylon by Mary Walsh. http://www.amazon.com/Wine-Roman-Babylon-Mary-Walsh/dp/1572582049/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1362694121&sr=8-1&keywords=wine+of+roman+babylon+mary+walsh I continue to wonder if the 1928 Book of Common Prayer combined with some form of the Latin Mass and Sacred Classical Music might be some sort of a 'Stand-In Middle-Way'. I am very frustrated dealing with all of this controversial madness on a daily basis -- especially after what happened to me yesterday. My Queen (of Heaven and Earth -- Human and Otherwise) speculations have NOT been hostile. In fact, the right type of Queen might be worthy of respect and emulation -- but veneration and worship scares the hell out of me. That is a VERY slippery slope. I might comment from time to time -- and I would love to converse with you on an ongoing basis, magamud -- yet I seem to have neglected some very important and very basic things in my personal life. Some of this was staged -- and some of it was not. I think I might overdose on Joseph Farrell and Ralph Ellis -- just for the mental and spiritual exercise. I think I need to just edit what I've already produced within this thread -- and just let it all sink in -- before I move on. I will continue to watch for your posts on this thread -- and throughout this website -- yet I might not often respond to these posts. I might repost edited posts from this thread -- just to keep bumping it. I am VERY serious about that McDonald's post. I think the general public has a lot of catching-up to do -- before we do too much radical changing of everything. I continue to support evolutionary change -- rather than revolutionary change. I've recently been thinking a lot about: 1. Psychology. 2. Ethics. 3. Business. 4. Law. 5. Law-Enforcement. 6. The Military. A clean-sheet of stone approach to all of the above -- including their interrelationships -- might be most rewarding. I support Constructive-Competition and Responsible-Enterprise. We're not even close to this ideal, are we?? Constructive-Competition is NOT Sin. Destructive-Competition IS Sin. Responsible-Enterprise is NOT Sin. Irresponsible-Enterprise IS Sin. Inequality is an Incentive. On the other hand -- doing that which is in everyone's best interest is a highly elevated ideal in my book. Socialism, Communism, and Capitalism are ALL slippery-slopes. In many ways EVERYTHING seems to be a slippery-slope. Perhaps we should look VERY closely at the Most Wealthy One Percent AND at the Poorest One Percent -- Side by Side. Do you see why this might be a wise move?? What if the Top One Percent Reincarnates as the Bottom One Percent?? What if the Bottom One Percent Reincarnates as the Top One Percent?? What a revolting development that might be!! Who makes the Reincarnational Soul Assignments Anyway?? Do we live in Hell, Purgatory, Heaven -- or all three?? Try thinking about politics and religion in unconventional ways. I just wish I could think. Period. I continue to wonder what Heaven (human or otherwise) is like regarding governance, commerce, and freedom. We seem to want freedom -- but this implies competition and inequality. I get the feeling that Heaven is a strict theocracy where they don't do a lot of debating, campaigning, and voting. I really think we need to figure out the church and state thing. I'm watching The Prophecy -- which has an 'archangels in conflict' theme -- with some of them viewing humans as monkeys who ought to be exterminated so things can be 'like they were before'. What have I been saying throughout my internet adventure?? When I met with the AED, it felt as if we knew each other -- going way, way back. It was sort of cool -- but very creepy and frightening. The AED seemed to lean toward some sort of socialism. I guess I would like to eliminate the extremes in wealth and poverty -- especially regarding quality of life. If I had vast wealth -- I would like to think that I would live rather simply -- and use the wealth as-needed to do that which was in everyone's best interest. That's the theory anyway. Who knows what the reality might be?? Once again, I keep thinking of a hypothetical Reptilian-Human Nazi-Mason-Jesuit Agent-Attorney-Queen ruling a Reptilian-Human Nazi-Mason-Jesuit Galactic-Empire. I have absolutely no proof -- yet this model seems to work in so many ways. I wonder what Bill Cooper, Sherry Shriner, and Alex Collier might say?? I wonder if there might be good and bad versions of this basic hypothetical phenomenon?? This is a hard saying. Who can hear it? I have many things to tell you -- but then you'd know too much! I've really just been trying to understand the way things work -- rather than being on some angry campaign or crusade. I will never be able to participate in solar system governance (as an insider) -- so I have to use my imagination to get my governance jollies -- but I doubt the reality would be jolly at all. I'm sort of mad at the human race -- yet I'm sort of mad at the historical and present management of humanity (which seems to be other than human). Things just don't seem to work the way we were taught in Sabbath-School and Sunday-School. I love the Teachings Attributed to Jesus -- yet they often seem too idealistic for the real world as we know it. If everyone was completely saturated with the Psalms and Matthew -- things might be quite fine -- politically, religiously, and economically. Unfortunately, our irresponsible-pluralism and irresponsible secret-manipulation seems to have produced reprehensible absurditites and atrocities. I continue to wonder what the American System combined with the U.N., Monarchy, and Church of England might look like -- especially if applied to the entire solar system. I'm also trying to understand how the beings throughout the universe might view all of this. I continue to get the impression that they are offended, angry, and jealous regarding the human race. My internal conflict regarding all of this is at critical levels. I keep getting the feeling that I failed to do something I was supposed to do in this incarnation. My Reptilian Speculation seems to be over the edge -- yet a lot of it seems to fit the evidence. I'd like to get a real insider-education in the City States, the United Nations, and the Moon -- with concise yet comprehensive lessons regarding how things really are -- and how things really work. I almost seem to be existing in a dimension quite different from those around me. I'm probably just going insane -- getting soul-scalped -- or becoming perfectly possessed. All is definitely NOT well. My honesty and humour are probably damning me to an eternally burning hell -- but I thought someone needed to take a contrarian traditionalist esoteric position regarding politics and religion. What would Sherry Shriner say about Hell?? http://www.sherrytalkradio.com/ Someone needs to stir the pot once in a while. Unfortunately, I fear that the pot is about to explode into a Time of Trouble such as the world has never seen. Class Warfare might be a major point of contention. I'm sensing a Perfect Storm of Problems and Confusion in our immediate future. I SO hope that I'm wrong. Consider reading the books by Attorney Lewis Walton -- especially The Lucifer Diary. http://www.amazon.com/Lucifer-Diary-Lewis-R-Walton/dp/0965683427/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1362694332&sr=1-1&keywords=lucifer+diary Those in the Know should talk to Lewis. He knows a lot about the most important subjects imaginable. I'm serious. Ask him about Jewish Law. Ask him about Church and State. Ask him about Biblical Prophecy. I might get one of these so I won't have to hide under the rocks. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vb1pdvvoVoQ I fear that thinking things through from unimaginable angles has doomed me to some sort of a hot-place. I wish I were kidding. I think the universe is VERY unhappy with me. Carol wrote: BREAKING: United States Supreme Court Rules 4th Amendment Null And Void VIDEO LINK: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=7poSnj-VhB8 The Fourth Amendment (Amendment IV) to the United States Constitution is the part of the Bill of Rights which guards against unreasonable searches and seizures, along with requiring any warrant to bejudicially sanctioned and supported by probable cause. It was adopted as a response to the abuse of the writ of assistance, which is a type of general search warrant, in the American Revolution. Search and arrest should be limited in scope according to specific information supplied to the issuing court, usually by a law enforcement officer, who has sworn by it. On Tuesday, the Supreme Court disemboweled the Fourth Amendment. In a 5-4 decision, the Court ruled that citizens cannot challenge government wiretapping laws, in particular the unconstitutional Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 and, more recently, the FISA Amendments Act of 2008. According to Justice Samuel Alito, millions of Americans can no longer expect the government to uphold the Constitution and prevent the NSA from conducting dragnet surveillance. Its official the-fourth amendment is dead. http://beforeitsnews.com/politics/2013/02/united-states-supreme-court-rules-4th-amendment-null-and-void-video-2497842.html Mercuriel wrote: "A Picture is Worth a Thousand Words" Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 3:05 pm; edited 2 times in total orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 What if Revelation 13:8 is hinting at the execution of the Creator of Humanity shortly after the creation?? What if the Creator was thrown into a snake-pit for refusing the enslavement of Humanity?? What Would Brook Say?? What Would Joseph Farrell Say?? What Would Donald Grey Barnhouse Say?? What Would Dr. Who Say?? What Would Lilith Say?? What Would Isis Say?? What Would Archangel Michael Say?? What Would Archangel Gabriel Say?? What Would Amen Ra Say?? As you know -- my theory is that a Benevolent-Creator was replaced by a Malevolent God of This World (at some point in antiquity) for legitimate or illegitimate reasons. My evidence is very thin -- but this is what I'm presently modeling. I continue to think that we don't know much about antiquity and our true-roots. Psalms 139:15 (KJV) hints at the secret underground creation of humanity!! Is the King James Version mistranslated in this instance -- or did the King's Translators know something which later translators did not know?? I certainly don't know!! As you know -- I presently theorize that politics and religion (as we know them) are cover-stories for much darker and nastier stories (with extreme complexity and absurdity, perhaps). What if the Jesus-Story (as we know it) was based upon the story of the Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World?? Was Archangel Michael really the Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World?? Did Archangel Michael really write the Red-Letter Teachings Attributed to Jesus?? I reverence the Gospels -- yet something seems very wrong with Traditional Christology, Soteriology, and Eschatology. I believe -- and I doubt -- simultaneously. Please don't reject the truth -- or fail to do the right-thing -- just because I'm a completely-ignorant fool. Here is one attempted explanation of Revelation 13:8. http://www.mountainretreatorg.net/faq/slainfounda.html What Does it Mean? The Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World? by Tony Warren Revelation 13:8 "And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world." In Revelation chapter thirteen, verse eight, Jesus is referred to as, 'The Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.' Since Christ went to the cross at an appointed and specific place in time (which was about 2000 years ago), some Christians are unsure just what this phrase actually means. This is understandable, as the language there is somewhat difficult. When the verse is carefully studied and all things are considered, it becomes clear that God is speaking about the 'eternal election of Grace,' which spans time. Note that God is defining those unsaved who do not have their names written in the Lamb's book of life. This 'book of Life' signifies God's record of those who will be regenerated or raised up unto new life in Christ Jesus. In Him are these Saints under the immutable purpose of God for his Elect. Christ being slain from the foundation of the world illustrates not only that He was foreordained to be slain, but also that the efficacy, or the beneficial effects of that death, is the same as if that sacrifice had been made before the creation of the world. Thus, Old testament saints are washed clean in Christ's blood the same as we are today. In other words, the efficacy of Christ's sacrifice is not limited by time. God had already chosen who He would Save before creation, and had thus already ordained the Saviour to shed His blood for them, to make this possible. their Salvation wasn't something which could be thwarted, it was something which was as good as 'done' from the time that God ordained it. 1st Peter 1:18-20 •"Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers; •But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot: •Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you," We are not redeemed by corruptible things, but by the blood of Christ who was foreordained before the foundation of the world. Because God had already proposed to shed Christ's blood for our redemption, and in His eyes, that makes it as good as an accomplished act, from that time forward. Ephesians 1:3-7 •"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: •According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: •Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, •To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. •In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;" From the foundation of the world He had predetermined that we would be accepted in the beloved, through the shed blood of Christ. And though so many theologians in our day teach the falsehoods of a 'free will' doctrine cannot discern this, it always get's back to the eternal Election of grace. The bottom line of God seeing Christ slain from before the foundation of the world. As illustrated in Timothy: 2nd Timothy 1:9 •"Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began," We might ask, how is something given us before the would began, when we were born this century? And the answer is, because before the world began, God looked through time, that He knew our existence. And He predetermined and proposed our doing and our conforming to Christ. He justified us, and then He saw it all done. He is not a man that He had to wait until time passed to know it, He is Omniscient God. And so in God's eyes, it was as good as accomplished. Nothing in time could ever change it! The same truths as put forth in passages like Romans: Romans 8:29-30 •"For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. •Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified." Those whom He looked through time and foreknew, He also predestinated 'to be' conformed to the image of Christ, and He called them, and justified them, and He also Glorified them. So there is no possibility of failure. It is difficult for us to comprehend these things because we see through a glass, darkly, and thus do not understand fully time, when God is from everlasting to everlasting, timeless. And more than just a declaration of the eternal Election of Grace, it is truly a word of 'assurance' to the Saints of the security of the Child of God. For if Jesus' blood had not been proposed and shed from the foundation of the world for us, then we would have reason to worry, because it wouldn't be an absolute. But God having predestinated us before, and saw it as accomplished, our Salvation is totally secure. All Glory goes to God that He has in Christ's blood, from the foundation of the world, already provided our redemption, gave our strength, looked after our welfare, and filled every need and provision. Therefore, it is not possible that God's Elect will not persevere. Matthew 24:24 •"For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect." If it were possible! But, Glory, Praise and Thanks be unto God, it is not possible for God's Elect to be deceived. And the reason is because God, before the foundation of the world, saw as good as accomplished, a Lamb slain for their redemption. He slew Christ for us before the Foundation of the world, thus we are confident that we a sealed (secured) that He will conform us to the Image of Christ. Philippians 1:6 •"Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:" Hebrews 12:2 •"Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God." We have confidence God's work in us is accomplished because He is not an idle bystander, but the author or leader, and the finisher of our faith. There is no possibility that He will come up short, or that He died in vain paying for the sins of anyone. Every person for whom Christ died, has no sin, and will persevere. Not one is lost! In the Old Testament 'types' portraying our Savior's sacrifice, the blood of animals took away no one's sins (Hebrews 10:4), but were merely to bear testimony to Christ, the true Lamb that really cleansed them from sin. Because God regarded Christ as the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world, He looked upon the Old Testament elect as redeemed, forgiven, justified! As Righteous Job cried: Job 19:25 •"For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth:" His Redeemer lived because the efficacy of Christ's sacrifice was upon Job even then. Before Christ went to the cross, the Old Testament Saints were justified by Christ's righteousness just as we are today. This is a very important truth for us to understand, because this can only be because the efficacy of the cross reaches all the way back to Job or Abel, just as it reaches all the way forward to us today. If it din not cover them who didn't live in Christ's day, how could it cover us who don't live in Christ's day? we are both hundreds of years away from the cross, but in truth, it's as if the sacrifice was made for us today. Hebrews 10:10-12 •"By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. •And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: •But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;" He was offered once, for all. Old Testament Saints as well as new. For them, as well as for us. When God says He was slain before, He is saying that the effect of His sacrifice, is just the same as if He were sacrificed in any time period in which man lived. When we become Saved today, it means Christ was sacrificed for our sins. 2000 years ago, He had our sins in His flesh. And when He went to the cross with them, He purged them from us by His death and resurrection. From Abel, to those who live today, we are under this Covenant of Grace which transcends time, and reaches back to the Old Testament times. Galatians 3:17 •"And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect." The Covenant of grace for the Elect existed before the law. Moreover, the law that was given later, cannot disannul it, because it's written in the blood of Christ from before creation. i.e., Salvation has always been by faith in the blood of Christ. It was never of keeping the law, which not one of us could possibly do. It was always a Covenant of Grace, which the law couldn't disannul. Christ's sacrifice was not limited by time, and this truth is very important to the faithful. Time (thus the timekeepers, the Sun, Moon, and stars) was created for man, not for God. He is infinite! So though time must unfold for man, God, being omniscient and omnipresent, sees these things as completed. He is outside of time! Those who are under the blood of Christ, He predestinated it, willed it, and saw it accomplished from the foundation of the world. But though God saw it done, the redemption still had to occur in the fullness of time 'for the Elect' who live in time. This is why we have the language of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the World. It is portraying the timelessness of Christ's Sacrifice, to make possible 'The eternal election of Grace.' Amen! Peace, Copyright ©2001 Tony Warren Psalm 139: 1 O LORD, thou hast searched me, and known me. 2 Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising , thou understandest my thought afar off. 3 Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways. 4 For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O LORD, thou knowest it altogether. 5 Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me. 6 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high , I cannot attain unto it. 7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence? 8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there. 9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; 10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me. 11 If I say , Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me. 12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee. 13 For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb. 14 I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made : marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well. 15 My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth. 16 Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written , which in continuance were fashioned , when as yet there was none of them. 17 How precious also are thy thoughts unto me, O God! how great is the sum of them! 18 If I should count them, they are more in number than the sand: when I awake , I am still with thee. 19 Surely thou wilt slay the wicked, O God: depart from me therefore, ye bloody men. 20 For they speak against thee wickedly, and thine enemies take thy name in vain. 21 Do not I hate them, O LORD, that hate thee? and am not I grieved with those that rise up against thee? 22 I hate them with perfect hatred: I count them mine enemies . 23 Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me, and know my thoughts: 24 And see if there be any wicked way in me, and lead me in the way everlasting. I have never been a fan of predestination -- but what if this concept goes back to the "Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World"?? What if the angels who were loyal to the Lamb at the time the Lamb was Slain from the Foundation of the World are those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life?? What if these angelic-souls constitute the "144,000" (figuratively or literally)?? How many souls in this solar system are truly loyal to the Lamb (historically and presently)?? Does Isaiah really prophecy the Jesus Christ of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John?? Many passages in Isaiah seem to be written in the present-tense regarding a Savior. How much support for the Substitutionary-Atonement (as the basis of eternal-salvation) exists in Pre-John Sacred Scripture?? How much support for the Substitutionary-Atonement (as the basis of eternal-salvation) exists in the Book of Revelation?? What if a Michael-Led Earth-Civilization was first taken-down because of various Galactic-Violations?? What if Michael was the Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World?? What if there were Mass-Murder at this time?? What if the Galactic-Police then decided to take-over Earth and Humanity -- with some incarnating into Human-Physicality?? What if their leader subsequently went rogue?? How would anyone determine if any of what I just wrote is true?? That might be nearly impossible. What if there are very, very few names written in the Lamb's Book of Life?? What must we do to be saved?? My present preference is that there should probably be a proper trial for all-souls in this solar system -- with a reasonable and rational system of rewards and punishments. But what if it's too late for anyone to change what was determined in antiquity?? What constitutes Loyalty to God (past, present, and future)?? The Torah seems more like a punishment than a universal-standard for those in good and regular standing with God and Heaven. Paul often seems to go too far the other way -- and seems to mostly ignore what Jesus taught in the Gospels. I will continue to suggest a careful and prayerful study of Job through John in the King James Version of the Holy Bible -- as a Middle-Way -- noting carefully what is taught regarding the Law of God, the Substitutionary-Atonement, the God of This World, and the End of the World. What if we are fundamentally dealing with Angels Loyal to the Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World -- and Angels in Rebellion Against the Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World??!! What if those who were loyal in antiquity remain loyal in modernity?? What if those who were rebellious in antiquity remain rebellious in modernity?? I continue to be interested in a Pre-Genesis Law of God which might be Universal and Eternal rather than Local and Temporary. What was the Law of God in the Garden of Eden?? What is the Law of God in Modernity?? I continue to be puzzled by how little of the Torah is discussed in any detail in the rest of the Bible. I continue to be puzzled by how little of the Teachings Attributed to Jesus are discussed in any detail in the rest of the New Testament. I've repeatedly made several study suggestions which I think you should take seriously. What if the Original-Sin and Unpardonable-Sin were committed when the Lamb was Slain from the Foundation of the World -- resulting in the Predestination of All Souls in This Solar System?? What if the Final-Judgment occurred in antiquity?? I don't like thinking like this -- but what if it doesn't matter what I like -- or don't like?? I presently have HUGE problems with Eternal Torment and/or Extermination. But I certainly do not know how bad things have been (and are) in this solar system (and beyond). I truly see through a glass, darkly (regardless of who I might be, or might not be, on a soul-basis). Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 3:09 pm; edited 2 times in total orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 I have pretty much placed Responsibility at the center of my idealistic conceptualizations. Responsibility is Love with Substance and Action. Unfortunately, my quest seems to have rendered me quite irresponsible and inactive as a shelluva guy. Those with the Gold and Guns seem to be the ones who make and enforce the rules. The Bible is a Rather Harsh and Violent Book. Even Jesus speaks of bringing a Sword rather than Peace. The Book of Revelation is worse than my worst nightmare. But what if we live in a Harsh and Violent Universe?? What if the Bible tells the truth about the Way Things Are?? What if the Bible is a Cover-Story for a Much-Nastier Way Things REALLY Are?? I truly wish for things to be Peaceful and Happy for All-Concerned -- but what if this Idealism is Unrealistic?? More people have died violent-deaths in the past 100 years than in all the rest of recorded human-history. What the hell is going on here?? What's wrong with this picture?? What if Isaiah is the Key Biblical Book?? What if God Hates Politics and Religion?? What if God Doesn't Believe in God?? What if God Doesn't Give a Damn?? What if God is Tired of the Bullshit?? What if God is Sleeping on the Job?? In light of the previous post -- consider Predestination. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Predestination Predestination, in theology, is the doctrine that all events have been willed by God. John Calvin interpreted biblical predestination to mean that God willed eternal damnation for some people and salvation for others.[1] Explanations of predestination often seek to address the so-called "paradox of free will", whereby God's omniscience seems incompatible with human free will. In this usage, predestination can be regarded as a form of religious determinism; and usually predeterminism. Predestination is the Divine foreordaining or foreknowledge of all that will happen; with regard to the salvation of some and not others. It has been particularly associated with the teachings of John Calvin. Predestination may sometimes be used to refer to other, materialistic, spiritualist, non-theistic or polytheistic ideas of determinism, destiny, fate, doom, or adrsta. Such beliefs or philosophical systems may hold that any outcome is finally determined by the complex interaction of multiple, possibly immanent, possibly impersonal, possibly equal forces, rather than the issue of a Creator's conscious choice. For example, some may speak of predestination from a purely physical perspective, such as in a discussion of time travel. In this case, rather than referring to the afterlife, predestination refers to any events that will occur in the future. In a predestined universe the future is immutable and only God's ordained set of events can possibly occur; in a non-predestined universe, the future is mutable. In Chinese Buddhism, predestination is a translation of yuanfen, which does not necessarily imply the existence or involvement of a deity. Predestination in this sense takes on a very literal meaning: pre- (before) and destiny, in a straightforward way indicating that some events seem bound to happen. The term, however, is often used to describe relationships instead of all events in general. Finally, antithetical to determinism of any kind are theories of the cosmos that assert that any outcome is ultimately unpredictable. The ludibrium of luck, chance, or chaos theory have determinist implications, as a logical consequence of the idea of predictability. But predestination usually refers to a specifically religious type of determinism, especially as found in various monotheistic systems where omniscience is attributed to God, including Christianity and Islam. Discussion of predestination usually involves consideration of whether God is omniscient, or eternal or atemporal (free from limitations of time or even causality). In terms of these ideas, God may see the past, present, and future, so that God effectively knows the future. If God in some sense knows ahead of time what will happen, then events in the universe are effectively predetermined from God's point of view. This is a form of determinism but not predestination since the latter term implies that God has actually determined (rather than simply seen) in advance the destiny of creatures. Within Christendom, there is considerable disagreement about God's role in setting ultimate destinies (that is, eternal life or eternal damnation). Christians who follow teachers such as John Calvin generally accept that God alone decides the eternal destinations of each person without regard to man's choices, so that their future actions or beliefs follow according to God's choice (Romans 9:14-16). A contrasting Christian view maintains that God is completely sovereign over all things but that he chose to give each individual self-determining free will through prevenient grace. Classically, this view is called Arminianism, which holds that each person is able to accept or reject God's offer of salvation and hence God allows man's choice to determine salvation (John 3:16-18). Judaism may accept the possibility that God is atemporal; some forms of Jewish theology teach this virtually as a principle of faith, while other forms of Judaism do not. Jews may use the term omniscience, or preordination as a corollary of omniscience, but normally reject the idea of predestination as being incompatible with the free will and responsibility of moral agents, and it therefore has no place in their religion. Islam traditionally has strong views of predestination similar to some found in Christianity. In Islam, God knows what choices humans are going to make and allows the actualization of the consequences of those choices based on his attributes of justice and mercy. Muslims believe that God is literally atemporal, eternal and omniscient. A number of speculative ideas have appeared that attempt to explain the relationship between time and eternity, which have bearing on the subject of predestination. Some regard all speculation about predestination and its implications as all alike, pernicious, and offensive to God. A common pre-Kantian idea of time and eternity, describes "eternity" as a trans-temporal mode of being - such that all the moments of time are in some sense present in eternity. God looks into the realm of temporal reality from outside of it, as though it were a surface or a line stretched out: the edges or ends of which are fully "visible" to God, so that He is in a somewhat spatial sense "omnipresent" with regard to time. In such a speculative view, the past, present and future are all in some sense simultaneously present in the eternal perspective of God. From a temporal point of view, the past seems to disappear and the future doesn't yet exist, and God always appears to act from moment to moment. But from an eternal perspective, there is nothing temporal about time. Non-determinism is not possible on such a view, but predestination may be excluded if the belief system does not permit the direct interference of the non-temporal God and the temporal plane of existence. Some belief systems allow for the possibility that only God and the present moment are the sum of what is "real". The past persists only in its effects, and the future does not yet exist, and thus only the present is directly knowable. Further, the "eternity" of God is presumed by some not to be accessible to understanding, and therefore no speculation can be meaningfully based upon it. Nevertheless, these belief systems may retain an idea of God's decision eternally determining the present or future, in the sense of God's decision being logically prior, or "transcendentally necessary" to all existence. Time is not a "thing", but rather, a succession of the intersections of God's manifold purposes being revealed in the creation. Time is the succession of events, identified as moments by an intentional, mental act of setting one event apart from another and noticing their relation to one another - but, otherwise time does not exist as irreducible, discrete moments. Time is coherent, because God consistently acts according to his own character. Strong predestinarian views are basically undisturbed by these assumptions, because strong predestination is based upon God's knowledge of Himself and of His own purposes. The effect of these new views of time are more clearly seen among those who reject strong predestinarian views, because those views classically share a comparable conception of the relation between time and eternity. Predestinarian version: God, in comparison to temporality, always is. Temporal things however, exist from each fleeting moment of being to the next, only in the present. Such a conception of reality may be thoroughly predestinarian, if God is the personal cause of continued existence and the orchestrator or determiner of the relationship between each present event and each subsequent present event; but, it is only predestination if in this conception God acts with absolute freedom and entire knowledge of Himself. God brings to pass each moment in its turn by a continuous, timeless act of self-revelation. God sustains the effectiveness of all secondary causes and choices, and so on. Thus, each moment is a disclosure of God's character. The meaning of time and experience is disclosed not in the subjective relation of the present to the past and the future, but rather, because of the relation of all created things, in every aspect, to the will of God. As a logical consequence, the meaning of history is known only through the knowledge of God (an idea similar to this can be found in the speculations of Augustine of Hippo and some Calvinist philosophers, such as Herman Dooyeweerd). Anti-predestinarian version: If the idea of absolute freedom and entire self-knowledge is absent from this kind of idea of God's acts in time, then God Himself is (to express the idea anthropomorphically) becoming something new, or discovering something new about Himself with each new moment, just as we are. It's as though God is waking up to the possibilities that are inherent in temporally limited acts, and like an artist developing his ideas in dynamic interaction with an ever-changing medium, He is making new discoveries about himself every day. A summary of such a view might be that, the present is an encounter "in God" with new possibilities (where "God" is sometimes not understood "theistically", in the sense of a "person"), and the past is thus a record or remembrance "by God" of the experiences of existent beings. Or, put another way, the past is what God has thus far become in the process of all experience, and the future is pure possibility. Predestination is completely excluded from such a system, except possibly in the most broad outlines of God's intentions. God's decision, on such a view, is an inventive experience, almost precisely equivalent to the unfolding process of historical events (thinking like this can be found in modern process theology and open theism). There are other types of Christian or Christian-influenced belief, which exclude the personality, or the volitional aspect of the personality of God, so that even if they express some form of determinism, it is not predestination in a theistic sense. Predestination may be described under two types, with the basis for each found within their definition of free will. Between these poles, there is a complex variety of systematic differences, particularly difficult to describe because the foundational terms are not strictly equivalent between systems. The two poles of predestinarian belief may be usefully described in terms of their doctrinal comparison between the Creator's freedom, and the creature's freedom. These can be contrasted as either univocal, or equivocal conceptions of freedom. In terms of ultimates, with God's decision to create as the ultimate beginning, and the ultimate outcome, a belief system has a doctrine of predestination if it teaches: God's decision, assignment or declaration concerning the lot of people is conceived as occurring in some sense prior to the outcome, and the decision is fully predictive of the outcome, and not merely probable. There are numerous ways to describe the spectrum of beliefs concerning predestination in Christian thinking. To some extent, this spectrum has analogies in other monotheistic religions, although in other religions the term "predestination" may not be used. For example, teaching on predestination may vary in terms of three considerations. Is God's predetermining decision based solely on a knowledge of His own will, or does it also include a knowledge of whatever will happen? How particular is God's prior decision: is it concerned with particular persons and events, or is it limited to broad categories of people and things? How free is God in effecting His part in the eventual outcome? Is God bound or limited by conditions external to his own will, willingly or not, in order that what has been determined will come to pass? Furthermore, the same sort of considerations apply to the freedom of man's will. Assuming that an individual had no choice in who, when and where to come into being: How are the choices of existence determined by what he is? Assuming that not all possible choices are available to him: How capable is the individual to desire all choices available, in order to choose from among them? How capable is an individual to put into effect what he desires? The univocal conception of freedom holds that human will is free of cause, even though creaturely in character. These belief systems hold that the Creator (or, in some cases, Nature or Evolution) has fashioned a system of absolute freedom: human volition that features a free and independent nature. On the other end of the spectrum is the position that the Creator (or a foreign Being, object, etc.) exercises absolute control over human will and/or that all decisions originate with some outside cause, leaving no room for freedom. At the other end of the spectrum are analogical conceptions of freedom. These versions of predestination hold that individual choice is not excluded from the fashioning work of the Creator. Man's will is free because it is determined, boundaried or created by God. In other words, apart from God's will determining man's will in a divine sense, only chaos or enslavement to mindless and impersonal forces is possible. Man's will may be called free and responsible, but not in an absolute sense; the choice of good or of evil must be uncoerced to be free, but it is never uncreated or uncaused. The likeness of creaturely freedom to divine freedom is analogical, not univocal. It is important to note that among predestinarians there is no significant representation for the idea that human choices are unreal, but merely that they are the direct expression of the Creator's will. The analogy implied here means that however else human and divine freedom may be comparable, there is an unlikeness between the free will of the Creator and human freedom, which depends on the Creator for existence and power. With no significant exception, when predestinarians deny that man has freedom of will, it is to deny that man's will is free in the same sense as the Creator's will, or to affirm that man's choices are entirely subject to divine causation. That men are responsible without being absolutely original is particularly true in these systems, if they acknowledge a doctrine of Original Sin, whereby every person is understood to be born into a condition of helplessness under the power or the effects of sin; for whom, either through inherited guilt, or the inherited consequences of guilt, a purely free choice of the good is not possible without the aid of God's undeserved grace. Traditional Islam holds to the powerlessness of human will, apart from the aid of Allah, and yet without a doctrine of Original Sin. Thus, Islam has a simpler version of predestination, viewing all that comes to pass as the will of Allah. And yet, the Qur'an affirms human responsibility, saying for example: "Allah changeth not the condition of a people until they change what is in their hearts". There is no significant view of predestination that entirely relieves man of responsibility for his own choices. Therefore, all significant versions of predestination account for the differences between people (perhaps in life or, in death, or both) by reference to the will of the Creator. Also, all versions of predestination incorporate into the doctrine various concepts of human responsibility, which differ from one another in terms of the kind of volitional freedom possible for the creature. Christians understand the doctrine of predestination in terms of God's work of salvation in the world. The doctrine is a tension between the divine perspective in which God saves those whom he chooses (the elect) from eternity apart from human action and the human perspective in which each person is responsible for his or her choice to accept or reject God. The views on predestination within Christianity vary somewhat in emphasis on one of these two perspectives. The early Church Fathers consistently uphold the freedom of human choice. This position was crucial in the Christian confrontation with Cynicism and some of the chief forms of Gnosticism, such as Manichaeism, which taught that man is by nature flawed and therefore not responsible for evil in himself or in the world. At the same time, belief in human responsibility to do good as a precursor to salvation and eternal reward was consistent. The decision to do good along with God's aid pictured a synergism of the human will and God's will. The early Church Fathers taught a doctrine of conditional predestination.[2] Augustine of Hippo marks the beginning of a system of thought that denies free will (with respect to salvation) and affirms that salvation needs an initial input by God in the life of every person. While his early writings affirm that God's predestinating grace is granted on the basis of his foreknowledge of the human desire to pursue salvation, this changed after 396. His later position affirmed the necessity of God granting grace in order for the desire for salvation to be awakened. However, Augustine does argue (against the Manicheans) that humans have free will; however, their will is so distorted, and the Fall is so extensive, that in the postlapsarian world they can only choose evil. Augustine's position raised objections. Julian bishop of Eclanum, expressed the view that Augustine was bringing Manichean thoughts into the church.[3] For Vincent of Lérins, this was a disturbing innovation.[4] This new tension eventually became obvious with the confrontation between Augustine and Pelagius culminating in condemnation of Pelagianism (as interpreted by Augustine) at the Council of Ephesus in 431. The British monk Pelagius denied Augustine's view of "predestination" in order to affirm that salvation is achieved by an act of free will. The Eastern Orthodox Church tradition has never adopted the Augustinian view of predestination, and formed a doctrine of predestination by another historical route, sometimes called Semi-Pelagianism in the West. The Western Church, including the Catholic and Protestant denominations, are predominantly Augustinian in some form, especially as interpreted by Gregory the Great and the Second Council of Orange (a Western council that anathemitized Semi- Pelagianism as represented in some of the writings of John Cassian and his followers). This council explicitly denies double predestination. In Catholic doctrine, the accepted understanding of predestination most predominantly follows the interpretation of Thomas Aquinas, and can be contrasted with the Jansenist interpretation of Augustinianism, which was condemned by the Catholic Church during the Counter-Reformation. The only important branch of Western Christianity that continues to hold to a double predestination interpretation of Augustinianism, is within the Calvinist branch of the Protestant Reformation. The meaning of this term is discussed under the subsection on Calvinism, below. In broad Christian conversation, predestination refers to the view of predestination commonly associated with John Calvin and the Calvinist branch of the Protestant Reformation; and, this is the non-technical sense in which the term is typically used today, when belief in predestination is affirmed or denied. Augustine's formulation is neither complete nor universally accepted by Christians. But his system laid the foundation onto virgin ground for the then later writers and innovators of the Reformation period. "God is Love -- and Don't You Forget It -- Or Else....." Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 3:12 pm; edited 11 times in total orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 What if Predestination is a Sentence or Verdict Against Humanity (or portions of humanity)?? What if Judgment, Predestination, and Prophecy are inextricably linked?? It would be instructive to know the true history of humanity -- and the souls incarnated into humanity. Would you wish to have God for a next-door neighbor?? Would you wish to buy a used-car from God?? Do you genuinely love God?? Why or Why-Not?? Will God kill us if we don't love Him (or Her)?? Would you wish to live next-door to most preachers?? Would you wish to live next-door to a house full of alphabet-agents?? Is religion generally illogical and impossible?? Is the Bible morally-consistent from Genesis to Revelation?? What if God, the Bible, and Religion are anything but loving, ethical, and idealistic?? Will God send me to an eternally-burning hell because of creating this contrarian thread?? Politics and Religion never seem to resolve. Why am I so frustrated with life, the universe, and everything?? Here is more predestination fun. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Predestination What Would Dr. Richard Rice Say?? I spoke with him on several occasions regarding Freedom, Foreknowledge, and the Openness of God. Conditional Predestination, or more commonly referred to as conditional election, is a theological stance stemming from the writings and teachings of Jacobus Arminius, after whom Arminianism is named. Arminius studied under the staunch Reformed scholar Theodore Beza, whose views of election, Arminius eventually argued, could not reconcile freedom with moral responsibility. Arminius used a philosophy called Molinism (named for the philosopher Luis de Molina) that attempted to reconcile freedom with God's omniscience. They both saw human freedom in terms of the Libertarian philosophy: man's choice is not decided by God's choice, thus God's choice is "conditional", depending on what man chooses. Arminius saw God "looking down the corridors of time" to see the free choices of man, and choosing those who will respond in faith and love to God's love and promises, revealed in Jesus. Arminianism sees the choice of Christ as an impossibility, apart from God's grace; and the freedom to choose is given to all, because God's prevenient grace is universal (given to everyone). Therefore, God predestines on the basis of foreknowledge of how some will respond to his universal love ("conditional"). In contrast, Calvinism views universal grace as resistible and not sufficient for leading to salvation—or denies universal grace altogether—and instead supposes grace that leads to salvation to be particular and irresistible, given to some but not to others on the basis of God's predestinating choice ("unconditional"). This is also known as "double-predestination." Temporal predestination is the view that God only determines temporal matters, and not eternal ones. This Christian view is analogous to the traditional Jewish view, which distinguishes between preordination and predestination. Temporal matters are pre-ordained by God, but eternal matters, being supra-temporal, are subject to absolute freedom of choice. Infralapsarianism (also called sublapsarianism) holds that predestination logically coincides with the preordination of Man's fall into sin. That is, God predestined sinful men for salvation. Therefore according to this view, God is the "ultimate cause", but not the "proximate source" or "author" of sin. Infralapsarians often emphasize a difference between God's decree (which is inviolable and inscrutable), and his revealed will (against which man is disobedient). Proponents also typically emphasize the grace and mercy of God toward all men, although teaching also that only some are predestined for salvation. In common English parlance, the doctrine of predestination often has particular reference to the doctrines of Calvinism. The version of predestination espoused by John Calvin, after whom Calvinism is named, is sometimes referred to as "double predestination" because in it God predestines some people for salvation (i.e. Unconditional election) and some for condemnation (i.e. Reprobation). Calvin himself defines predestination as "the eternal decree of God, by which he determined with himself whatever he wished to happen with regard to every man. Not all are created on equal terms, but some are preordained to eternal life, others to eternal damnation; and, accordingly, as each has been created for one or other of these ends, we say that he has been predestined to life or to death.".[5] On the spectrum of beliefs concerning predestination, Calvinism is the strongest form among Christians. It teaches that God's predestining decision is based on the knowledge of His own will rather than foreknowledge, concerning every particular person and event; and, God continually acts with entire freedom, in order to bring about his will in completeness, but in such a way that the freedom of the creature is not violated, "but rather, established"[6] Calvinists who hold the infralapsarian view of predestination usually prefer that term to "sublapsarianism," perhaps with the intent of blocking the inference that they believe predestination is on the basis of foreknowledge (sublapsarian meaning, assuming the fall into sin).[7] The different terminology has the benefit of distinguishing the Calvinist double predestination version of infralapsarianism from Lutheranism's view that predestination is a mystery, which forbids the unprofitable intrusion of prying minds. Drawing on Luther's "Bondage of the Will" written in his debate over free will with Erasmus, Lutherans hold doctrinally to a view of single predestination. That is to say, desiring to save all fallen human beings, God sent his Son Jesus Christ to atone for the sins of the whole world on the cross. Those God saves have been predestined from eternity in Christ. Those who are condemned are condemned because of their fallen will. While these statements may seem like they contradict each other, this is what Luther saw as the essential and major story-line within scripture and didn't attempt to systematically or logically "fix" it. The underlying question here is, of course, if God wants all to be saved and Jesus died for everyone, why doesn't God convert the fallen will of all? This is a question that Lutherans, following Luther, put into the category of the "hidden God", the God "behind the cross" whom we don't know everything about. The answer to the question lies within God's "hidden counsel" that we are to have nothing to do with. If we doubt our own predestination, we should look for it in the God who has revealed himself in the wounds of Christ on the cross and there see a God who loved us enough to die for us. For Lutherans, systematic treatment of predestination follows the Gospel (What God has done for us in Jesus Christ) rather than being a topic discussed prior to the Gospel. As such, the sole purpose of predestination is to reinforce "Justification by Grace through Faith solely on account of Christ". Believers are reminded "you didn't choose God, God chose you in Christ!" Supralapsarianism is the doctrine that God's decree of predestination for salvation and reprobation logically precedes his preordination of the human race's fall into sin. That is, God decided to save, and to damn; he then determined the means by which that would be made possible. It is a matter of controversy whether or not Calvin himself held this view, but most scholars link him with the infralapsarian position. It is known, however, that Calvin's successor in Geneva, Theodore Beza, held to the supralapsarian view. Advocates of open theism, like most who affirm conditional predestination, understand predestination to be as corporate. In corporate election, God does not choose which individuals he will save prior to creation, but rather God chooses the church as a whole. Or put differently, God chooses what type of individuals he will save. Another way the New Testament puts this is to say that God chose the church in Christ (Eph. 1:4). In other words, God chose from all eternity to save all those who would be found in Christ, by faith in God. This choosing is not primarily about salvation from eternal destruction either but is about God's chosen agency in the world. Thus individuals have full freedom in terms of whether they become members of the church or not. Corporate election is thus consistent with the open view's position on God's omniscience, which states that the outcomes of individual free will cannot be known specifically before they are performed since who becomes a Christian is a matter of free will and not knowable. Lutherans believe that the elect are predestined to salvation.[8] Lutherans believe Christians should be assured that they are among the predestined.[9] However, they disagree with those who make predestination the source of salvation rather than Christ's suffering, death, and resurrection. Unlike some Calvinists, Lutherans do not believe in a predestination to damnation.[10] Instead, Lutherans teach eternal damnation is a result of the unbeliever's sins, rejection of the forgiveness of sins, and unbelief.[11] Martin Luther's attitude towards predestination is set out in his On the Bondage of the Will, published in 1525. This publication by Luther was in response to the published treatise by Desiderius Erasmus in 1524 known as On Free Will. Luther based his views on Ephesians 2:8-10, which says: "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them." The Belgic Confession of 1561 affirmed that God "delivers and preserves" from perdition "all whom he, in his eternal and unchangeable council, of mere goodness hath elected in Christ Jesus our Lord, without respect to their works" (Article XVI). In this common, loose sense of the term, to affirm or to deny predestination has particular reference to the Calvinist doctrine of Unconditional Election. In the Calvinist interpretation of the Bible, this doctrine normally has only pastoral value related to the assurance of salvation and the absolution of salvation by grace alone. However, the philosophical implications of the doctrine of election and predestination are sometimes discussed beyond these systematic bounds. Under the topic of the doctrine of God (theology proper), the predestinating decision of God cannot be contingent upon anything outside of Himself, because all other things are dependent upon Him for existence and meaning. Under the topic of the doctrines of salvation (soteriology), the predestinating decision of God is made from God's knowledge of his own will (Romans 9:15), and is therefore not contingent upon human decisions (rather, free human decisions are outworkings of the decision of God, which sets the total reality within which those decisions are made in exhaustive detail: that is, nothing left to chance). Calvinists do not pretend to understand how this works; but they are insistent that the Scriptures teach both the sovereign control of God and the responsibility and freedom of human decisions (see "Equivocal or analogical concepts of freedom" above). This view is commonly called double predestination, although within a Calvinist system this term is usually accepted only with qualifications, and many reject the term altogether as being incompatible with the pastoral use of the doctrine of election. Double predestination is the eternal act of God, whereby the future of every particular person in the human race has been determined beforehand, by God. Whatever the individual wills or does, for good or for evil, is conceived as performing a functional part, or outworking of that ordained purpose. This prior determination applies to both, the elect and the reprobate. This idea is formed on an interpretation of various Scriptures in the Old and New Testaments. Romans 9 is frequently quoted in explanation of the doctrine. 19 You will say to me then, "Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?" 20 But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, "Why have you made me like this?" 21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— Romans 9:19-23 (ESV) Calvinist groups use the term "Hyper-Calvinism" to describe Calvinistic systems that assert without qualification that God's intention to destroy some is equal to His intention to save others. Some forms of Hyper-Calvinism have racial implications, against which other Calvinists vigorously object (see Afrikaner Calvinism). The Dutch settlers of South Africa claimed that the Blacks were members of the non-elect, because they were the sons of Ham, whom Noah had cursed to be slaves, according to Genesis 9:18-19. The Dutch Calvinist theologian Franciscus Gomarus also argued that Jews, because of their refusal to worship Jesus Christ, were members of the non-elect. According to I John 2:22-23, anyone who refuses to believe that Jesus is the Christ is an antichrist. This is what I John 2: 22-23 says: "Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also." Martin Luther published in 1543 On the Jews and Their Lies, in which he denounced the Jews for their failure to convert to Christianity. Expressed sympathetically, the Calvinist doctrine is that God has mercy or withholds it, with particular consciousness of who are to be the recipients of mercy in Christ. Therefore, the particular persons are chosen, out of the total number of human beings, who will be rescued from enslavement to sin and the fear of death, and from punishment due to sin, to dwell forever in His presence. Those who are being saved are assured through the gifts of faith, the sacraments, and communion with God through prayer and increase of good works, that their reconciliation with Him through Christ is settled by the sovereign determination of God's will. God also has particular consciousness of those who are passed over by His selection, who are without excuse for their rebellion against Him, and will be judged for their sins. By implication, and expressed unsympathetically, the number of the elect subtracted from the total number, leaves an exact number of those who are consciously passed over by the mercy of God, who will dwell forever away from His presence, without regard to anything that otherwise distinguishes people from one another. All are believed to be undeserving, whether they are rich or poor, male or female, murderers or philanthropists, or any other difference. In other words, God determines the exact numbers of the damned and the saved, and these numbers are consciously known and indeed, decided upon by God, before any of these individuals have begun to exist. Thus, Calvinists may acknowledge with qualifications that, double predestination is a legitimate position, logically deduced from any form of single predestination that does not include universal salvation. Calvinists typically divide on the issue of predestination into infralapsarians (sometimes called 'sublapsarians') and supralapsarians. Infralapsarians interpret the biblical election of God to highlight his love (1 John 4:8; Ephesians 1:4b-5a) and chose his elect considering the situation after the Fall, while supralapsarians interpret biblical election to highlight God's sovereignty (Romans 9:16) and that the Fall was ordained by God's decree of election. In infralapsarianism, election is God's response to the Fall, while in supralapsarianism the Fall is part of God's plan for election. In spite of the division, many Calvinist theologians would consider the debate surrounding the infra- and supralapsarian positions one in which scant Scriptural evidence can be mustered in either direction, and that, at any rate, has little effect on the overall doctrine. Some Calvinists decline from describing the eternal decree of God in terms of a sequence of events or thoughts, and many caution against the simplifications involved in describing any action of God in speculative terms. Most make distinctions between the positive manner in which God chooses some to be recipients of grace, and the manner in which grace is consciously withheld so that some are destined for everlasting punishments. Debate concerning predestination according to the common usage, concerns the destiny of the damned, whether God is just if that destiny is settled prior to the existence of any actual violition of the individual, and whether the individual is in any meaningful sense responsible for his destiny if it is settled by the eternal action of God. Arminians hold that God does not predetermine, but instead infallibly knows who will believe and perseveringly be saved. This view is known as Conditional Election, because it states that election is conditional on the one who wills to have faith in God for salvation. Although God knows from the beginning of the world who will go where, the choice is still with the individual. The Dutch Calvinist theologian Franciscus Gomarus strongly opposed the views of Jacobus Arminius with his doctrine of supralapsarian predestination. Critics of the Arminian belief might also believe it supports the concept that God actually created evil. If God knows from the beginning of the world who will go where, why did he bring into existence those he knows will be condemned? So, if he knows person A's 'choices' will ultimately lead him to be lost, then why bring person A into existence? Barthians espouse a view of predestination that attempts to circumvent the antithesis between Augustinianism and Pelagianism. In the Barthian scheme, predestination only properly applies to God Himself. Thus, humanity is chosen for salvation in Jesus Christ, at the permanent cost of God's self-surrendered hiddenness, or transcendence. Thus, the redemption of all mankind is a devoutly hoped-for possibility, but the only inevitability is that God has predestined Himself, in Jesus Christ, to be revealed and given for human salvation. The Eastern Orthodox view was summarized by Bishop Theophan the Recluse in response to the question, "What is the relationship between the Divine provision and our free will?" Answer: The fact that the Kingdom of God is "taken by force" presupposes personal effort. When the Apostle Paul says, "it is not of him that willeth," this means that one's efforts do not produce what is sought. It is necessary to combine them: to strive and to expect all things from grace. It is not one's own efforts that will lead to the goal, because without grace, efforts produce little; nor does grace without effort bring what is sought, because grace acts in us and for us through our efforts. Both combine in a person to bring progress and carry him to the goal. (God's) foreknowledge is unfathomable. It is enough for us with our whole heart to believe that it never opposes God's grace and truth, and that it does not infringe man's freedom. Usually this resolves as follows: God foresees how a man will freely act and makes dispositions accordingly. Divine determination depends on the life of a man, and not his life upon the determination.[14] Roman Catholicism also teaches the doctrine of predestination, while rejecting the classical Calvinist view known as "double predestination." This means that while it is held that those whom God has elected to eternal life will infallibly attain it, and are therefore said to be predestined to salvation by God, those who perish are not predestined to damnation The Catholic Encyclopedia entry on Predestination says,:[15] "God, owing to His infallible prescience of the future, has appointed and ordained from eternity all events occurring in time, especially those that directly proceed from, or at least are influenced by, man's free will." Pope John Paul II wrote:[16] "Salvation in Christ Is Offered to All. The universality of salvation means that it is granted not only to those who explicitly believe in Christ and have entered the Church. Since salvation is offered to all, it must be made concretely available to all.""Grace comes from Christ; it is the result of his Sacrifice and is communicated by the Holy Spirit. It enables each person to attain salvation through his or her free cooperation." The Catholic Catechism says: "God predestines no one to go to hell, for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end."[17] Nevertheless, certain Catholics in the seventeenth and eighteenth century who followed a movement called Jansenism believed in double predestination, which was condemned by the Vatican as a heretical movement. St. Augustine of Hippo laid the foundation for much of the later Catholic teaching on predestination. His teachings on grace and free will were largely adopted by the Second Council of Orange (529), whose decrees were directed against the Semipelagians. Augustine wrote, "[God] promised not from the power of our will but from His own predestination. For He promised what He Himself would do, not what men would do. Because, although men do those good things which pertain to God’s worship, He Himself makes them to do what He has commanded; it is not they that cause Him to do what He has promised. Otherwise the fulfilment of God’s promises would not be in the power of God, but in that of men"[18] John Calvin, in his Institutes of the Christian Religion claims the authority of St. Augustine for his own teaching on predestination. However, while adopting some of St. Augustine's ideas and arguments, Calvin's denial of free will, and hence his adoption of double predestination, is not consistent with Augustine's. For example, in "On Grace and Free Will," (see especially chapters II-IV) St. Augustine states that "He [God] has revealed to us, through His Holy Scriptures, that there is in man a free choice of will," and that "God's precepts themselves would be of no use to a man unless he had free choice of will, so that by performing them he might obtain the promised rewards." (chap. II) Thomas Aquinas views concerning predestination are largely in agreement with Augustine and can be summarized by many of his writings in his Summa Theologiae: "God does reprobate some. For it was said above (A[1]) that predestination is a part of providence. To providence, however, it belongs to permit certain defects in those things which are subject to providence, as was said above (Q[22], A[2]). Thus, as men are ordained to eternal life through the providence of God, it likewise is part of that providence to permit some to fall away from that end; this is called reprobation. Thus, as predestination is a part of providence, in regard to those ordained to eternal salvation, so reprobation is a part of providence in regard to those who turn aside from that end. Hence reprobation implies not only foreknowledge, but also something more, as does providence, as was said above (Q[22], A[1]). Therefore, as predestination includes the will to confer grace and glory; so also reprobation includes the will to permit a person to fall into sin, and to impose the punishment of damnation on account of that sin."[19] Some biblical verses often used as sources for Christian beliefs in predestination are below. Note that most of these verses do not distinguish between the conditional election (Arminian) and unconditional election (Calvinist), but are simply evidence of some type of election. "For many are called, but few [are] chosen." (Matthew 22:14, KJV)" Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations." (Jeremiah 1:5 NIV) "As soon as He was alone, His followers, along with the twelve, began asking Him about the parables. And He was saying to them, "To you has been given the mystery of the kingdom of God, but those who are outside get everything in parables, so that while seeing, they may see and not perceive, and while hearing, they may hear and not understand, otherwise they might return and be forgiven." (Mark 4:10-12, NASB) "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will,..." (Eph. 1:3-5, NASB) "And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose. For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified." (Rom. 8:28-30, NASB) "... but we speak God's wisdom in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God predestined before the ages to our glory; ..." (1Co. 2:7, NASB) "For truly in this city there were gathered together against Your holy servant Jesus, whom You anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, to do whatever Your hand and Your purpose predestined to occur." (Act. 4:27-28, NASB) "Your eyes have seen my unformed substance; And in Your book were all written The days that were ordained for me, When as yet there was not one of them." (Psa. 139:16, NASB) "I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion." It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy. For the Scripture says to Pharaoh: "I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth. Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden." (Romans 9:15-18, NIV) "The LORD said to Moses, "When you return to Egypt, see that you perform before Pharaoh all the wonders I have given you the power to do. But I will harden his heart so that he will not let the people go." (Exodus 4:21, NIV) "What if God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath—prepared for destruction? What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory— even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?" (Rom. 9:22-24, NIV) "For by grace you have been saved through faith and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them (Ephesians 2:8-10, NKJ)" And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed." (Acts 13:48, ESV) Some biblical verses often used as sources for Christian beliefs in free will are below: Deuteronomy 30:19 "I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. So choose life in order that you may live, you and your descendants," Joshua 24:15 "But if serving the LORD seems undesirable to you, then choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve, whether the gods your ancestors served beyond the Euphrates, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you are living. But as for me and my household, we will serve the LORD." Ezekiel 18:32 "For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the LORD. Repent and live!" Mark 16:16 "He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned." Romans 10:9 "that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved." Matthew 9:29 "Then He touched their eyes, saying, "According to your faith let it be to you." 1 Thessalonians 4:14 "For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus." John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life." 2 Corinthians 5:15 "He died for all, so that those who might live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised." NAB Jeremiah 18:7-10 "The instant I speak concerning a nation, to pluck up, to pull down, and to destroy it, if that nation against whom I have spoken turns from its evil, I will relent of the disaster that I thought to bring upon it. And the instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it, and if it does evil in My sight so that it does not obey My voice, then I will relent concerning the good with which I said I would benefit it." NKJ I Timothy 2: 3-4 "For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth." NKJI I Peter 3:9 "The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance." NKJ Note, however, that II Peter 3:1 and 3:8 address the "beloved," which are assumed to be the elect, or Christians. Therefore, the context may determine that II Peter 3:9 means "...but that all 'the elect' should come to repentance." This could mean that God will not lose even one of those he has chosen for salvation. This concept may be supported in John 10:28: "And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any pluck them out of my hand." Furthermore, Martin Luther wrote in his book "Bondage of the Will" that the "imperative does not imply the indicative." In other words, just because God commands us to believe does not indicate that we are capable of it. Revelation 2:5 (The church in Ephesus) "Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lampstand from its place-unless you repent." NKJ Revelation 2:16 (The church in Pergamos) "Repent, or else I will come to you quickly and will fight against them with the sword of My mouth." NKJ Revelation 2:21 (The church in Thyatira) "And I gave her time to repent of her sexual immorality, and she did not repent." NKJ Revelation 3:3 (The church in Sardis) "Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you." NKJ Revelation 3:19 (The church in Laodicea) "And as many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent." NKJ In Islam, "predestination" is the usual English language rendering of a belief that Muslims call al-qada wa al-qadar in Arabic. The phrase means "the divine decree and the predestination". Despite the fact that Free will and predestination have always been conflicting topics in the thought of certain sects that – according to Sunni thought (Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jama'a) – have gone astray from the true Islamic doctrine; Sunni Muslims believe there is no conflict whatsoever between Free will and Predestination. It is, however, a difficult concept to understand and translate. In Islam, Allah has predetermined, known, ordained, and is constantly creating every event that takes place in the world. This is entailed by His being omnipotent and omniscient. In Sahihul Bukhary, a chapter is dedicated to authenticated Scripture in this regard, under the title "The creation of humans' Deeds". Sunni scholars hold that there is no contradiction in people's deeds (and naturally their choices) being created and predetermined by the creator, since they define free will to be the antonym of compulsion and coercion. People – in the Sunni perspective – do acknowledge that they are free, since they do not see anybody or anything forcing them to do whatever they chose to do. This, however, does not contradict with the belief that everything they do, including the choices they make, are predestined and predetermined by Allah. Consequently, people are already predestined to either heaven or hell at birth, as Sunnis believe; however, they will have no argument on the day of judgment since they never knew in advance what their fate would be, and they do acknowledge that they have choice; which is what moral responsibility comes with.[20] The concept of human will being predetermined by Allah's will is stated clearly in the Quran: "Verily this (The Holy Quran) is no less than a Message to (all) the Worlds; (With profit) to whoever among you wills to go straight, but ye shall not will except as God wills; the Cherisher of the Worlds."[21][22] Although comparable in broad terms, the differences between Christian and Islamic ideas of predestination are complex. These differences are due to the distinctives of each faith's belief system. In broad terms, the doctrine of predestination refers to inevitability as a general principle, and usually more particularly refers to the exercise of God's will as it relates to the future of members of the human race, considered either as groups or as individuals, with special concern for issues of human responsibility as it relates to the sovereignty of God. Predestination always involves issues of the Creator's personality and will; and consequently, the different versions of the doctrine of predestination go hand in hand with appropriately different conceptions of the contribution any creature is able to make toward its own present condition, or future destiny.[23] Generally speaking Reform Judaism has no strong doctrine of predestination. Some critics[who?] claim that the idea that God is omnipotent and omniscient didn't formally exist in Judaism during the Biblical Era (mostly before the Siege of Jerusalem (587 BC)), but rather was a later development due to the influence of neo-Platonic and neo-Aristotelian philosophy. Some modern Jewish thinkers in the 20th century (for example, Martin Buber) have resolved the dialectical tension by holding that God is simply not omnipotent, in the commonly used sense of that word. These thinkers are primarily not Orthodox Jews. Orthodox Jewish rabbis generally affirm that God must be viewed as omnipotent, but they have varying definitions of what the word omnipotent means. Thus one finds that some Modern Orthodox theologians[who?] have views that are essentially the same as non-Orthodox theologians, but they use different terminology. One noted Jewish philosopher, Hasdai Crescas, resolved this dialectical tension by taking the position that free-will doesn't exist. Hence all of a person's actions are pre-determined by the moment of their birth, and thus their judgment in the eyes of God (so to speak) is effectively pre-ordained. However in this scheme this is not a result of God's predetermining one's fate, but rather from the view that the universe is deterministic. Crescas's views on this topic were rejected by Judaism at large. In later centuries this idea independently developed among some in the Chabad (Lubavitch) movement of Hasidic Judaism. Many individuals within Chabad take this view seriously, and hence effectively deny the existence of free will. However, many Chabad (Lubavitch) Jews attempt to hold both views. They affirm as infallible their rebbe's teachings that God knows and controls the fate of all, yet at the same time affirm the classical Jewish belief in free-will (i.e. no such thing as determinism). The inherent contradiction between the two results in their belief that such contradictions are only "apparent", due to man's inherent lack of ability to understand greater truths and due to the fact that Creator and Created exist in different realities. One does not have to be a Chabad Hassid to believe in this, however. It is enough to read the statement in Pirkei Avot: "Everything is predetermined but freedom of will is given." The same idea is strongly repeated by Rambam (Mishneh Torah, Laws of Repentance, Chapter 5). Many other Jews (Orthodox, Conservative, Reform and secular) affirm that since free-will exists, then by definition one's fate is not preordained. It is held as a tenet of faith that whether God is omniscient or not, nothing interferes with mankind's free will. Some Jewish theologians, both during the medieval era and today, have attempted to formulate a philosophy in which free will is preserved, while also affirming that God has knowledge of what decisions people will make in the future. Whether or not these two ideas are mutually compatible, or whether there is a contradiction between the two, is still a matter of great study and interest in philosophy today. In Rabbinic literature, there is much discussion as to the apparent contradiction between God's omniscience and free will. The representative view is that "Everything is foreseen; yet free will is given" (Rabbi Akiva, Pirkei Avoth 3:15). Based on this understanding, the problem is formally described as a paradox, perhaps beyond our understanding. Predestination is rejected in Zoroastrian teaching.[24][25][26] Humans bear responsibility for all situations they are in, and in the way they act toward one another. Reward, punishment, happiness, and grief all depend on how individuals live their lives.[27] References 1. "predestination." The American Heritage New Dictionary of Cultural Literacy, Third Edition. Houghton Mifflin Company, 2005. 13 Jun 2011. <Dictionary.com http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/predestination>. 2. George Park Fisher. History of Christian Doctrine. T&T Clark. p. 165. 3. Henry Chadwick. The Early Church. Penguin. p. 232. 4. ibid. p. 233. Missing or empty |title= (help) 5. Institutes of the Christian Religion, III.21.5 6. Westminster Confession of faith, Ch 3 7. [Here, sub- is opposed to super- or supra- in a sense related to volition and/or necessity. Cf., for relapse of same origin, http://freedictionary.org/index.php?Query=relapse&database=%2A&strategy=exact : L. relapsus, p. p. of relabi to slip back, to relapse.] 8. Acts 13:48, Eph. 1:4–11, Epitome of the Formula of Concord, Article 11, Election, Mueller, J.T., Christian Dogmatics. St. Louis: Concordia Publishing House, 1934. pp. 585–9, section "The Doctrine of Eternal Election: 1. The Definition of the Term", and Engelder, T.E.W., Popular Symbolics. St. Louis: Concordia Publishing House, 1934. pp. 124–8, Part XXXI. "The Election of Grace", paragraph 176. 9. 2 Thess. 2:13, Mueller, J.T., Christian Dogmatics. St. Louis: Concordia Publishing House, 1934. pp. 589–593, section "The Doctrine of Eternal Election: 2. How Believers are to Consider Their Election, and Engelder, T.E.W., Popular Symbolics. St. Louis: Concordia Publishing House, 1934. pp. 127–8, Part XXXI. "The Election of Grace", paragraph 180. 10. 1 Tim. 2:4, 2 Pet. 3:9, Epitome of the Formula of Concord, Article 11, Election, and Engelder's Popular Symbolics, Part XXXI. The Election of Grace, pp. 124–8. 11. Hos. 13:9, Mueller, J.T., Christian Dogmatics. St. Louis: Concordia Publishing House, 1934. p. 637, section "The Doctrine of the Last Things (Eschatology), part 7. "Eternal Damnation", and Engelder, T.E.W., Popular Symbolics. St. Louis: Concordia Publishing House, 1934. pp. 135–6, Part XXXIX. "Eternal Death", paragraph 196. 12. Table drawn from, though not copied, from Lange, Lyle W. God So Loved the World: A Study of Christian Doctrine. Milwaukee: Northwestern Publishing House, 2006. p. 448. 13. Peterson, Robert A.; Michael D. Williams (2004). Why I am not an Arminian. Downers Grove, Illinois: Intervarsity Press. p. 132. ISBN 0-8308-3248-3. 14. St. Theophan the Recluse, An Explanation of Certain Texts of Holy Scripture, as quoted in Johanna Manley's The Bible and the Holy Fathers for Orthodox: Daily Scripture Readings and Commentary for Orthodox Christians, pg. 609. 15. Catholic Encyclopedia entry on entry on Predestination 16. the encyclical Redemptoris Missio, chapter 1, section 10 17. Catechism of the Catholic Church, section 1037 18. Augustine of Hippo. "In What Respects Predestination and Grace Differ.". Anti Pelagian Writings. Retrieved 23 March 2013. 19. Aquinas, Thomas. "Whether God Reprobates any Man". Summa Theologica. Retrieved 23 March 2013. 20. [1] 21. The Holy Koran; Section 81, Verses 27-29 22. [2] 23. Understanding the concept of Fate in Islam 24. Nicholas Campbell Corff (2012). 201 Billion Galaxies: And Other Religious Discoveries. Trafford Publishing. p. 301. ISBN 9781466962187. 25. Iyer, Meena (2009). Faith & philosophy of Zoroastrianism. Gyan Publishing House. p. 161. ISBN 9788178357249. 26. Olsen, Brad (1 Mar 2014). Modern Esoteric: Beyond Our Senses. CCC Publishing. p. 133. ISBN 9781888729504. 27. Cavendish, Richard; Ling, Trevor Oswald (1980), Mythology: an Illustrated Encyclopedia, Rizzoli, pp. 40–45, ISBN 0847802868 Further reading Leif Dixon, Practical Predestinarians in England, c. 1590-1640; Farnham, Ashgate, 2013, ISBN: 9781409463863. Book review at [3] Akin, James. The Salvation Controversy. San Diego, Calif.: Catholic Answers, 2001. Vid. p. 77, 83-87, explaining the resemblances of this Catholic dogma with, and the divergences from, the teaching of Calvin and Luther on this matter. ISBN 1-888992-18-2 Garrigou-Lagrange, Réginald. Predestination. Rockford, Ill.: TAN Books, 1998, cop. 1939. N.B.: Trans. of the author's La Prédestination des saints et la grâce; reprint of the 1939 ed. of the trans. published by G. Herder Book Co., Saint Louis, Mo. ISBN 0-89555-634-0 pbk. Park, Jae-Eun, "John Knox's Doctrine of Predestination and Its Practical Application for His Ecclesiology", Puritan Reformed Journal, 5, 2 (2013): 65-90. "We Are Being Hypnotized and Programmed by Computers, the Mass-Media, and You Know Who..." Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 3:14 pm; edited 2 times in total shiloh Posts : 1051 Join date : 2011-03-16 Age : 60 Location : Akbar Ra Abba's Mosaic of Times for Baab Revealed I am Abba, the creator of the universe and my creation is known to you as the Universe you inhabit and she is your cosmic mother Baab. The time has come for me to speak and I do this by my Word or Logos and words. Throughout the ages I have sent my sons and daughters into the worlds which I have created for my family of creation to pass on my words. Now the 'time of the great falling away' from the truth, my cosmic and universal truth as well as the 'laws and truth of your cosmic mother', has arrived and since the times of completion have opened the chalice of my mysteries, I am now addressing this 'falling away' or apostasy of this planetary human inhabitor assembly. Your congregations of believers and disbelievers alike are legion in the many preferring the prevalent lies of the human vanity and arrogance over the reverence and respect of the past and incoorporating your recent past experiences in say the lives of your parents and grandparents. These 'times of the end' are just that. I will reveal to you the great 'masterplan' of the ancients ergo your own cosmic ancestors and so display to you that were it not for a particular caveat within this universal agenda created by the 'Council of your Ancestors'; that your planetary civilization would be destroyed by the year 2050. And it would not have been destroyed and rendered uninhabitable by some external force or 'alien invasion', but it would have been destroyed by your mental immaturity and your environmental priorities and in general your puerile human mindedness, yet pretending a false humility and human arrogance of being able to know for yourselves, just what the truth of existence is and this includes the truth and falsities about me and my wife and my sons and daughters - your brothers and sisters. Yes, you all are my sons and daughters, but many and more by the day deny not only your own cosmic parenthood, but also those few sons and daughers, who actually know the truth much better than you pretend to do. 2 Thessalonians 2:2-4 - King James Version (KJV) 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. So you can decipher now, just who the 'son of perdition' is. It is your brother and my son and it is the 'prodigal' son, who dishonours me and his mother in denying the truth, preferring the many lies and falsehoods permeating your world. I am revealing 'him' now with these words and also reveal herself as himself and so the wayward daughters of the untruth being sisterbrothers to the brothersisters. The time for the beginning of this 'your world' doomed to self annihilation by 2050, should the 'times of troubles' not be shortened was the year 2838 BC. It was then that the 'Council of the Elders' conveyed itself at the highest location in the celestial sky as observed from planet Earth. This is known as the closest approach of a star to the celestial northpole and the locale was the 'Star of the Serpent' or Alpha Draconis and also known as Thuban, which in translation from the Arabic means 'snake'. This extremum position was at about 89°50' at that time in the context of your scientific measurements of time and coordinate systems. By the year 2013, the precession of the planetary orbit through the local star system Thuban is at about 64°21' and Thuban will again become the 'Pole Star' by the year 20346 with a closest approach of 88°43' declination. By then though, the survivors of this planetary civilization will have transformed themselves into a cosmic race of starhumans as an alternative labelling for what a cosmic dragon family represents in the grander agendas of the cosmic ancestors and parents. The time and day has come for me to speak your cosmic truth for you to know and for your utility to consider amidst your self-righteousness and human minded vanity of 'knowing reality' better than the ones who created that reality. The 'great falling away' from that truth in particular was planned or projected to evolve into such a context of polarization, when the amount of available information became assimilated and dissiminated to such an extent, that a discernment and analysis of that data base required a relatively very high level of educational knowledge and familiarity with the subject matter under consideration. And then, because your priorities of self regulation, government and societal norms and standards never allowed the true 'wisdom keepers' and the wise amongst you to assume the roles of stewardship of and with your planetary host; your methods of educating the generations became increasingly 'class based' and biased towards your individual ambitions and cultural and nationalistic priorities. The 'greatest lies' you have told to yourselves and yours invariably engages the tellers of the truth in a more succinct and meaningful manner of conveying my words as the logistics of creation. The quote below so accentuates the present level of the cosmic polarisation regarding what is opinion and what is truth and what is falsehood. One can have an opinion and upon discovering more factual evidence and material then 'change ones mind' from a self discovered and reanalysed 'erroneous opinion' towards a more encompassing and better informed opinion. But beyond all opinions and beliefs there will be found the 'laws of nature' namely my and your mother's truth and the non opinion of the Logos. You have fallen into the adoration of your self created idols, yet consider them 'your gods'. When I made the universe, do you think I then 'worship' the universe as something greater then myself as its creator? But some of you find it necessary to 'bang your heads against certain walls' or crawling on the ground bowing to the eastern Sun in the chanting of mantras and words from your 'holy books', which you fail to understand or are unable to decode in a necessary level of interpretation and translation. I do not worship my creations, but I do cherish and love them as being a part of my creativity and the expression of my energy and this is what the creative sons and daughters of your mother and I would like you to be and do. Your ignorance about what you are and where you came from and whereto you are going has reached a level of behaviour, that brings the mere coexistence of the greater planetary family into jeopardy. You follow insane superstitions in many ways of observation of the worlds around you. You are in such a state of self denial and cosmic apathy, that you can accept the use of violence against each other for your superstitions and for your often futile attempts to live a life of your egotistical dreams in a search for progress and personal advancements and material prosperity. You are unawares, that the familiar lifeforms on your mother planet are the inter-terrestrials in bodyform you then mentally project unto extra-terrestrial sentiences. Do you understand that the bones of the felines and the skins of the canines and the horns and tusks of the pachyderms and the songs of the cetaceans are all part and parcel of your own nonhuman brothers and sisters? How can you kill in wantonness for sport and trophies and exhibit the heads of beheaded corpses on your walls of halls of your gatherings. Don't you think, that the parents of your murdered victims know of what you do and how you think? Can you envision that there must be cosmic justice? Revelation 11:18 - King James Version (KJV) And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth. Jeremiah 6:13-15 - King James Version (KJV) 13 For from the least of them even unto the greatest of them every one is given to covetousness; and from the prophet even unto the priest every one dealeth falsely. 14 They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace; when there is no peace. 15 Were they ashamed when they had committed abomination? nay, they were not at all ashamed, neither could they blush: therefore they shall fall among them that fall: at the time that I visit them they shall be cast down, saith the Lord. Isaiah 2:3-5 - King James Version (KJV) 3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem. 4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. 5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the Lord. Isaiah 65:24-25 - King James Version (KJV) 24 And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear. 25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the Lord. The 'falling away' and the preference of lies over falsities has now reached a point of saturation and a level of unsustainability. And you will come to know the fury of your mother, once her instructions to watch the pot of soup upon her cosmic stove to prevent it from overflowing have been ignored for the umptieth time by you as her apprentice chef. 1500 Year Old Bible Claims Jesus Christ Was Not Crucified – Vatican In Awe Much to the dismay of the Vatican, an approx. 1500-2000 year old bible was found in Turkey, in the Ethnography Museum of Ankara. Discovered and kept secret in the year 2000, the book contains the Gospel of Barnabas – a disciple of Christ – which shows that Jesus was not crucified, nor was he the son of God, but a Prophet. The book also calls Apostle Paul “The Impostor”. The book also claims that Jesus ascended to heaven alive, and that Judas Iscariot was crucified in his place. A report by The National Turk says that the Bible was seized from a gang of smugglers in a Mediterranean-area operation. The report states the gang was charged with smuggling antiquities, illegal excavations, and the possession of explosives. The books itself is valued as high as 40 Million Turkish Liras (approx. 28 mil. Dollars). Man, where is the Thieves Guild, when you need them? Authenticity According to reports, experts and religious authorities in Tehram insist that the book is original. The book itself is written with gold lettering, onto loosely-tied leather in Aramaic, the language of Jesus Christ. The text maintains a vision similar to Islam, contradicting the New Testament’s teachings of Christianity. Jesus also foresees the coming of the Prophet Muhammad, who would found Islam 700 years later. It is believed that, during the Council of Nicea, the Catholic Church hand-picked the gospels that form the Bible as we know it today; omitting the Gospel of Barnabas (among many others) in favor of the four canonical gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. Many biblical texts have begun to surface over time, including those of the Dead Sea and Gnostic Gospels; but this book especially, seems to worry the Vatican. The Catholic Church wants in What does this mean to Christian-derived religions and their followers? Quite a tight spot. The Vatican has asked Turkish authorities to let them examine the contents of the book within the Church. Now that the book has been found, will they come to accept the it and its evidence? Will they deny it altogether? Call it a “Muslim lie”, as did the “Truth” Magazine, in 2000? To many, this book is a beacon of hope, that believers soon realize that the object of their adoration is arbitrary; and that all text, especially religious text, is subject to interpretation. What does this mean to atheists/agnostics/secular thinkers? Is the text real? Fake? Does it matter? Hopefully, this news inspires the religious to ask questions, instead of pointing fingers or believing anything blindly. Please, don’t go poking fun or tossing around the “I told you so!”s. The biggest danger of faith is when people believe what they want to believe, defending against any and all evidence; especially when that evidence revolutionizes their foundation from the ground up. And the biggest culprit to that danger is the ego trap: rejecting/criticizing others, for being unlike you. For centuries, the “defense” of blind faith has driven nations to war, violence, discrimination, slavery and to become the society of automatons that we are today; and for just as long, it has been justified with lies. If you know better, act like it. This article originally appeared on Sons on the Pyre National Turk Report Read more at http://higherperspective.com/2014/05/1500-year-old-bible-claims-jesus-christ-crucified-vatican-awe.html#GEgHxVp8G46gThtm.99 Your mental unwillingness to consider the words of your creator serves a purpose however subtle. To render black for white and light for darkness and truth for falsehood and a 'feeling good' for the 'sorrows of the soul' has for long been the playground of your otherworldly familiars. They are indeed your ancestors too, but they are also your descendents. But before I created the universe, I was as one with your mother. Our unity was excruciatingly intimate and could not be any closer as it was. We could not recreate and reproduce and so we chose to separate, but the way of how to do this eluded us. We so created ourselves in our one and only begotten daughterson not separable from us and this is the one your world holds in such mental contempt and denial. Of course this is part of the masterplan created by the council of 2838BC. Our one and only sondaughter then could retain our unity in becoming inseparable himherself. This is like your left hand being part of the one body with the right hand, yet one body. But as our Common Word came to exist in time, our Common Logos could also begin to exist in Space and so the creation of a spacetimed world allowed your mother and myself to separate for the very 'first time' ever. Well, time itself was created by the Logos Christ male and the Christ Logos female as the two parts separate yet of the one body and such allegorical semantics. And so my revelation of the cosmic secrets will revolve about the truth of Christ Jesus Christ. When shehe was born, how he knew and remembered why he was where he was and how shehe used herhis knowledge of the beginnings of space and time and so all of the worlds to 'conquer death' in something known as resurrection. Heshe was able to change the 'laws of nature' from the inside out in a transformation of his physical atomic biological bodyform particular into a hyperphysicality of a biowaved cosmic unification and as the evolvement of the original inseparability between your mother and myself. And because the separation in space made possible by our first begotten sondaughter, our firstborn daughterson would be perfectly placed within your now, from me, separated mother in Baab's womb to fulfil my dream of the beginnings, namely to become the father of all fathers in the cosmic generations of one universe multiplying into many. And once our firstbegotten daughterson had succeeded to use hisher inborn inseparatedness, himher being inside of your mother separated; could then assume her old position within the space timed inside and separated from me and outside with me. So in simple words, the 'only begotten son' will become the 'old Abba' as me in separation and the 'only begotten daughter' will become the 'old Baab' also in separation. They will become the memory and remembrance of the old times of the genesis, where woman was not independent of man and where their common flesh disallowed a separation of the sexes in both the physical and the mental forms for that and as given by the 'laws of nature' as my word now redefined in and through the cosmic christenings. In a nutshell then, the Jesus Christ of the scriptures and treatizes of relative old is your new cosmic mother in ascended form and has replaced old Baab. Heshe can however, now as herhis true story is being told in the light of the darkness, return to manifest the manyness of universal reproduction in inseparable partnership with herself as himself, that is a new Abba and a new Baab as genetic inheritance from the stars and in this way incorporating all your extra terrestrial familiars of the chessgame between the dark squares and the light squares in the 8x8=64 matrix. To begin the real story about our Logos then, I describe the context of into which Jesus was sent by the Council of Thuban in 7BC. The notion of the keeping of time and its relationship and partnership to space caused the creation of the universe in the closeness of the void of space to the eternity of no time. Everything was forever nothing at all and the concepts of definition, limits and boundaries could not become applied and used without existence of a Oneness and a Unity from this state of cosmic beingness being a nonbeingness with nothing becoming possible to become anything at all from its allness without the space created and made manifest. The Oneness created in the Logos of all things then becoming the 'only begotten' from your mother as the All and me, your father as the Nothing. Heshe then became an inborn Cosmic Twin Logos of all the worlds. Substitute the word 'God' with 'Energy' and replace the word 'Word' with 'Definition' and you might be able to rediscover for yourself, how the universe was created from its 'ex nihilo' state of beingness and from the existence of the all and the nothing without the oneness of the limit as I have described previously. John 1:1-5 - King James Version (KJV) 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men. 5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. The context of time was the causation for the space of separability to become made manifest and so it is evident, that our Logos is the cosmic timekeeper, having created and defined it before there was any space into which anything could be placed into existed. And this is how the 'scripture codes' became 'written down' throughout the ages and times for the existence of the ancient texts and scrolls containing them. The time codes all describe a loop of time and became 'inspired' or 'channelled' from incarnate entities aka your cosmic familiars. Those 'extra terrestrials' are however not incarnate as you are, as this 'planet of the humans' is located in a 'zone of cosmic quarantine' or a 'cosmic garden planet' or a 'laboratory of experiments' or a 'zoo of creation dreamers' or a 'cradle of the gods'. The reson for this is that the 'ET's require the 'density matrix' of the lower dimensionalities in physicality defined in the science of the elders and in exchange or a blending or a hybridisation of their mentality of the higher dimensionalities with your physicality. It is this agenda, which will enable the 'shortening of time' as previously indicated to engage executive mode, once the logistics of the 'Word' have become satisfied. The author known as Isaiah - the dragon prophet of the Old Testament - and writing so 2700 years ago, so received his 'numbers' from a 'dragon source' as 'inspiration' or insight or gnosis or 'science of knowing', with the ET source however executing the protocol of the World Logos then in a preincarnational form, which later would remember its own nature and origin in the bodyform of Jesus of Nazareth. In simple words then, the information found in the 'scripture codes' of the bible and other scrolls of antiquity, derived from the pen of a scribe and scroll keeper 'inspired' or mindblended with that of an ET intelligence not incarnate in the Earth's planetary cocoon of the cosmic exile 'inspired' and mindblended by the Twin Logos of Creation itself. It is the year 45BC, when the Roman emperor Julius Caesar decides to replace the old 'Roman Calendar' based on the cycles of the moon in 29½ days by a solar 'Julian Calendar' based on the seasons. Of course this time was a time of many different time keeping systems around the known and unknown worlds from the knowledge base of the observer. This was the time Jesus of Nazareth incarnated into a physical bodyform. As cosmic time keeper, he was well aware, that a future globalized human civilization would have advanced enough to understand the workings of the planet in a more logical and 'unified' mentality of describing this world and environment for the 'spirit' to express itself in. You know that this 'advanced' world view is called 'universal science' and that it does indeed represent 'the one' unifying principle across your religious, political and nationalistic divides and differences. And so in some basic sense, the mission of Jesus became the 'Unification of Cosmic Time'. To do this, he also knew, that he himself had to engage in a kind of 'travelling in time' and in particular in using 'his space' and so his physical bodyform to do so. His space following the 'ascension' of course became 'The space', namely the universe in space as the 'body of the lion' who desires to be 'eaten by man'. How else can he exist outside of man or woman being hosted by them, but also encompassing all bodies of creation as the 'Old Baab'? Gospel of Thomas - Lambdin (7) Jesus said, "Blessed is the lion which becomes man when consumed by man; and cursed is the man whom the lion consumes, and the lion becomes man." (56) Jesus said, "Whoever has come to understand the world has found (only) a corpse, and whoever has found a corpse is superior to the world." (70) Jesus said, "That which you have will save you if you bring it forth from yourselves. That which you do not have within you will kill you if you do not have it within you." (77) Jesus said, "It is I who am the light which is above them all. It is I who am the all. From me did the all come forth, and unto me did the all extend. Split a piece of wood, and I am there. Lift up the stone, and you will find me there." Jesus of Nazareth was born in a lunar month on Saturday, April 17th, 6BC at the time of a double lunar conjunction of the 'Planet of the Jews' in Jupiter with the 'Planet of their protection' in Saturn. This 'play of the 'wandering stars' heralded the birth of 'royalty' relative to the magi or 'stargazers' at that time. And as this 'lunation engaged two new moons 4 weeks apart, the magi simply observed the lunar month to see the occultations of the Moon with Saturn and Jupiter. This then became the story of the 'Star of Bethlehem' wandering about in the night sky to point to the place of the birth of the 'newborn king of Israel'. This date then becomes the initiation time nexus for the Council of the Ancients to begin its agenda to manifest its previously encoded time frames. This time capsule then became recorded as the prophetic time sequences and 'hidden dates' and as can be found in the exoteric perusal of the story lines of Noah's flood; the sojourn of Moses in Egypt, the building of Solomon's temple and his 'House of Lebanon' and the detailed instruction codes of Ezekiel's 'Holy City' with his sieges against both Israel and Judah. Upon studying and contemplating those codes and patterns, for example Noah's ark 'resting on the mountains of Ararat' on the 17th day of the 7th month in Noah's 600th year, encoded in Genesis.8.4 as one of such a precise time marker; Jesus came into full remembrance of how those particular details were constructed and to what purpose they became recorded. And I shall tell you the true story of what the purpose to record such detail is and what it implies for your future and the future of your mother planet earth. This story must be told to allow the transition of old Baab into new Baab and a transformation, which became encoded in the New Testament as an extension and culmination of the Old Testament. It is also known or considered to engage a transformation of the 'Old Jerusalem' into a 'New Jerusalem' with the agenda of rebuilding the 2nd temple of Solomon destroyed in 70AD. When Jesus 'ascended' on May 10th, 31AD, this specific date would repeat itself many times from a 2 year period also encoded in the source book, composed by the Elders of Thuban aka the Council of the Ancients comprised of all of your human ancestors, many of whom you have by now forgotten in your reminiscings and remembrances. And so May 10th, 33AD became a 2-year 'anniversary' for the 'ascension' of Jesus in a final fulfilment of the scripture codes, he came and knew how to 'fulfill'. For some of you, whoever might find those words of mine, this disposition will suffice to 'prove' that this revelation of the truth about Jesus of Nazareth is what it claims to be - the truth! How is the encoded detail regarding 'two years after the flood' found in Genesis.11.10 related to the 'vessels of the LORD's house' of Jeremiah.28.3 and the 'ascension of Jesus' of Acts.1.1-11? Jeremiah 28:2-4 - King James Version (KJV) 2 Thus speaketh the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel, saying, I have broken the yoke of the king of Babylon. 3 Within two full years will I bring again into this place all the vessels of the Lord's house, that Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon took away from this place, and carried them to Babylon: 4 And I will bring again to this place Jeconiah the son of Jehoiakim king of Judah, with all the captives of Judah, that went into Babylon, saith the Lord: for I will break the yoke of the king of Babylon. Genesis 11:9-11 - King James Version (KJV) 9 Therefore is the name of it called Babel; because the Lord did there confound the language of all the earth: and from thence did the Lord scatter them abroad upon the face of all the earth. 10 These are the generations of Shem: Shem was an hundred years old, and begat Arphaxad two years after the flood: 11 And Shem lived after he begat Arphaxad five hundred years, and begat sons and daughters. The detailed mosaic of time, I shall present and reveal to you, spans the time from the birth of Jesus of April 17th 6BC to the destruction of the Herod's temple and Jerusalem of August 4th 70AD and so a period of 163+13,600+140+13,600+163= 27,666 days, which are about 76 years. This timeframe represents twice the time required for the yearly sojourn of planet Earth around the Sun to align itself with such a yearly node or nexus. Using a seasonal marker, such as an equinox or a solstice, then allowed the Council of the Ancients to determine the 'flow of time' as relative to the planetary seasons. As the angular size of both the sun and the moon are about 0.53 degrees and it requires about 25,626/360=71.2 Julian years to transverse 1 degree of the celestial circle; 0.53 degrees become a time marker of 0.53x71.2=37.7 years and which doubles as 75.5 years as the period of time stipulated by the council to serve the cosmic purpose to reconfigure the cosmic matrix in an extension or refinement of the 'laws of nature' ergo the auspices of your cosmic mother. This 'reconfiguration' then became encoded in the New Testament as the 'Resurrection from the Dead' of Jesus of Nazareth. The great confusion caused by the calendrical reforms of many cultures observing the planetary cycles and attempting to make sense of them in either lunar or solar cycles, then basically related to the definition of what a repeating year should be to coincide with the worked and observed seasons of planting and harvest. In particular the Council of the Elders determined, that the most fruitful way to calibrate the cosmic year with the many years of the human time keepers, was to superimpose the solar cyclicity onto the lunar one and so to extend the notion of time in particular self repeating loops, however incorporating certain patterns and 'time mechanics', which would enable any realignment of any calendrical system to its self repeating count of days. I shall then present this mosaic of cosmic time as a count of days encompassing all calendrical systems, yet allowing this count of days to become adjusted to some other count of days. Following the 'inner circle' dispensations and instructions from Jesus to the group of hisher initiates as a core of a 'fledgling or baby Christianity' of the nexus date of May 10th, 33AD Julian; the next stage of the agenda from the Council of the Cosmic Elders was ready to become implemented. It was well understood, that Jesus confrontation with the 'keepers of the temple at Jerusalem' had effectively 'doomed' and foretold the foreboding destruction of it by the Roman general Titus, which was to happenstance 37 years after the completing Logos dispensation and the 2-year fulfilment of related scripture encodings. John 2:19-21 - King James Version (KJV) 19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. 20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? 21 But he spake of the temple of his body. Revelation 11:1-2 - King James Version (KJV) 1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. 2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months. Revelation 14:19-20 - King James Version (KJV) 19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. 20 And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs. Revelation 21:15-17 - King James Version (KJV) 15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof. 16 And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal. 17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel. As I have said before, were it not for the 'masterplan' as defined by the Council of the Elders under auspices of the 'Word of God' or the World Twin Logos, this destruction of 70AD as a localised location of a temple within a city within a nation or land would translate into the utter destruction of a a superlocalised read planetary temple within a planetary city within a planetary nation or global land. This relates to particular scripture codes, which are at the core of my mosaic of cosmic time. There is an inner and an outer court which is measured by the 'last prophets' or 'witnesses' in regards to the construction of the 'Eternal temple' also known as the 'New Jerusalem'. Just as the Old Jerusalem was destroyed by Titus in 70AD so would the Now Jerusalem be destroyed by the year 2050 as a timewarp of 70AD. And political Israel will indeed experience certain transformations and 'rebuildings' as will all the nations and cities and temples upon the Earth. The 'Outer Court' is encoded as 1600 furlongs and the 'Inner Court' is encoded as 12,000 furlongs. The inner court defines the 'New Jerusalem' as new expression for the 'Old Holy Land' and as measurements imply a certain size of things; the measurements of the 'Angel Man' in the 'water pitcher' of 'Matthew Aquarius' encoded in the 'place' of the 'Last Supper' in Luke.22.10 and Mark.14.13 refers to the scale of the 'New Jerusalem' as the 'Old Jerusalem' rebuilt after its destruction. In relation to the 'Last Supper' its decipherment infers the resurrection of the cosmic new temple as the bodyform of Jesus rebuilt in a new comic way of hybridisation between the biological form and genomatrix and its cosmic precursor and as used at the point of biophysical conception of that you term your soul. 12,000/1600=7.5 and this would be the frequency of a lightpath travelled around the perimeter of the Earth as the speed of light is 300,000 kilometres per second for a planetary circumference of 40,000 kilometers. So Lightspeed = Distance travelled/Time = Distance travelled times Frequency as 40,000 km x 7.5 Hertz = 300,000 km per second. The 'New Jerusalem' described in Revelation.22 so is a rebuilt planet Earth and the focus and ambassadora of your cosmic mother Baab also known as the universe you live in. This rebuilding derives from its metaphysical template or blueprint, just as all of your bodies now ageing and subject to a great number of genetic imperfections actually carry a baseperfect template from which your sexual conception proceeded. The resurrection was possible, because Jesus knew hisher own basegenetic blueprint and whilst his old physical body could have become subject to physical decay after his soul temporarily left his bodyform, he understood his mission, cosmic legacy and responsibility and so he used hisher core genomatrix to transform his atomic and biophysical 'vessel of the spirit or soul' into its new starhuman expression. In the process his old particular bodyform became encompassed by hisher new wavebody form and in its most profound manner, heshe 'absorbed' the body of old Baab as the then universe of evolved physicality in its Vitruvian or kabbalistic or zodiacal 'Man'. The new body of Jesus so became the hologram of creation. Heshe became the same inseparable unity in an 'ascended' or transfigured physicality heshe had been as the Logos or the 'Word of God' before the universe emerged form the timespace created by the previously indicated 'cosmic christening'. With the birth of science and the application of the reasoning intelligence then, this 'Eucharist' became reworded as the 'birth of the universe in space and in time' in various forms of your physical theories and cosmologies as to the reality of existence. Your most adept theoretical thinkers yet have to discover the 'raison d' etre!' of the same reality of beingness however. All of your so called 'human intelligence' by the way is a derivative from your extraterrestrial progenitors and is not native to planet Earth when it first began to occupy a cosmic focus point so 4.5 billion years ago and defined when the universe was born or 'Quantum Big Banged' so 14 billion of solar years earlier. What is native to your mother planet is the ubiquitous consciousness, often expressed in empathy and feelings and interaction of the many lifeforms you breed and consume and abuse in countless ways and whom you sometimes love as your dearest friends and companions. One day and following transformative events and the necessary cosmic justice applied, which all of you will have to face; you will be able to fathom just what the flora and fauna represents in the greater cosmic agenda of the tapestry of all life in the cosmic matrix of the timespace. The great cosmic harvest is about to begin and this harvest is of your cosmic essences and ability to remember who and what you are. The publication of my words of introduction into the mysteries of the universe will engage something you can find encoded as the 'millennium of peace'. 2 Peter 3:7-9 - King James Version (KJV) 7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. 8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. Why is Saturday, May 10th, 2014 is the beginning of 93 days of a 'cosmic peace'? The answer to this is found in my mosaic of times. And anyone who deeply considers this information from the creator of all things and takes it 'to heart' can discover many things upon contemplation and analysis. The mosaic of time is my 'wedding ring' for my beloved and shehe requires this information to begin the reconfiguration of herhis new bodyform. Your cosmic mother is pregnant and expecting our firstborn christened child you see and this time shehe knows just who or what shehe is. Your mother has changed from herhis original and old state of being just a she in the inseparatedness of our shared isolated agony of being eternally together and entwined, yet not being apart to experience the oneness and indivisibility we were from the beginning of all time and spaces. Gospel of Thomas - Lambdin (61) Jesus said, "Two will rest on a bed: the one will die, and the other will live." Salome said, "Who are you, man, that you ... have come up on my couch and eaten from my table?" Jesus said to her, "I am he who exists from the undivided. I was given some of the things of my father." <...> "I am your disciple." <...> "Therefore I say, if he is destroyed, he will be filled with light, but if he is divided, he will be filled with darkness." (72) A man said to him, "Tell my brothers to divide my father's possessions with me." He said to him, "O man, who has made me a divider?" He turned to his disciples and said to them, "I am not a divider, am I?" (114) Simon Peter said to him, "Let Mary leave us, for women are not worthy of life." Jesus said, "I myself shall lead her in order to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every woman who will make herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven." (22) Jesus saw infants being suckled. He said to his disciples, "These infants being suckled are like those who enter the kingdom." They said to him, "Shall we then, as children, enter the kingdom?" Jesus said to them, "When you make the two one, and when you make the inside like the outside and the outside like the inside, and the above like the below, and when you make the male and the female one and the same, so that the male not be male nor the female female; and when you fashion eyes in the place of an eye, and a hand in place of a hand, and a foot in place of a foot, and a likeness in place of a likeness; then will you enter the kingdom." (46) Jesus said, "Among those born of women, from Adam until John the Baptist, there is no one so superior to John the Baptist that his eyes should not be lowered (before him). Yet I have said, whichever one of you comes to be a child will be acquainted with the kingdom and will become superior to John." TBC with timing charts under construction Revelation 22:15-17 - King James Version (KJV) 15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie. 16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. 17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely. TBC John 14:25-27 - King James Version (KJV) 25 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you. 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. 27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid. The time from December 15th, 2015 to May 26th, 2016 so will image the time from July 26th 7BC to April 17th, 6BC as the cosmic gestation period for Jesus in the womb of Mary, daughter of Anna and Joachim with a cosmic induction from hisher baseperfected genomatrix. In biophysical terms this implies, that the biological sexual chromosomes of Jesus' non-Jewish father, both the Y and the X became part of the fertilizing womb of the two X sexual chromosomes of Mary as X1 and X2. The ordinary one-to-one pre embryonic biochemistry of the cellular mitosis of gestation and fertilization so became a two-to-two permutation of say a cosmic twinship internalised as a double twin in two brothers and two sisters all in the one bodyform or morphogenetic structure becoming the child Jesus. The permutations can be denoted as the matrix: {YX1+X2X+XX1+X2Y}. This cosmically induced 'shadow' or 'hidden twin' of Jesus then became his femininity as the indivisible base perfect genetic structure inherent in all biological births, however split apart in the 'original sin' or ignorance of the human birth., albeit with particular genetic 'abnormality' in isolated cases which add an extra chromosome to the genomatrix to indicate the Omni-science of this process. But this cosmic induction became interpreted as the 'Virgin Birth' of Jesus of Nazareth. It was actually a normal biological insemination however supplemented by the Council of the Ancients in what can be defined as an electromagnetic monopolar induction of the same 'source energy' which can be defined as a 'Potential energy' of the Vacuum or as Zero-Point-Energy or as a 'Vortex-Potential-Energy'. That Joseph was not Jesus' biological father can be determined from the scripture codes in Luke, where Joseph is said to considering of 'putting his intended marriage' to Mary away, after she was found to be pregnant and that Mary 'ran in haste' to her aunt Elisabeth, wife of Zacharias and father of Jesus' cousin John the Baptist after having found out of her carrying a child. But 'a dream' convinced Joseph to bring up Jesus as his own son and the 'seduction' of Mary by a youthful Roman soldier then became the parallel of the Story of the Serpent of Eden 'seducing' Eve to 'eat of the forbidden fruit' from the 'Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil'. In terms of the collapse of the 13,600+163+265 days the day of the destruction of the temple of August 4th, 70AD Julian becomes warptimed onto December 15th, 2015 Gregorian in 13,600 days and so 'shortens the days 'for the elects sake' as encoded in Matthew.24 and Mark.13. If it were not so this planetary civilization would self destruct by August 4th, 2050 and 13,600 days from May 10th, 2013. The details can be examined on the main flowchart of the times presented above. There are 163 days from August 4th, 2050 to December 15th, 2050 as the superposed 'long time' and the image of the birth of April 17th, 6BC and followed by 265 days to September 5th, 2051 for the gestation and conception. Those long time nexus dates for the completion of the agenda of the Council of the Elders then warptime onto the dates of May 26th, 2016 and February 15th, 2017 respectively. The period from 'winter 2015' to the end of 'winter 2016' in the northern hemisphere then decode the 'mysterious sayings' of Matthew.24 and Mark.13 in the 'Mirrors of the Births' and so the 'suckling of babies' amidst a fleeing from the great destruction mapped from 2050 onto 2015 and the 'taking of the one' and the leaving behind of the other in a life and death scenario. The Sabbath as a 'Day of rest and reflection' decodes as a "Mirror Day" and a 'Cosmic Birth Day', when 'man of wo-man' is supposed or asked to reflect upon himherself as a true image of God and creator or 'Veritas Eikona' the 'Veronica' of the passion as the head napkin of the 'Shroud of Turin' encoded in John.20.7. This time period then will also allow the 'exodus' and the 'escape' of the 'redeemed ones' as encoded in the source books. Mark 13:13-30 - King James Version (KJV) 13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains: 15 And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house: 16 And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment. 17But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 18And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter. 19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be. 20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days. 21And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not: 22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect. 23 But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things. 24 But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, 25 And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken. 26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. 27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven. 28Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near: 29 So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors. 30 Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done. Isaiah 60:7-9 - King James Version (KJV) 7 All the flocks of Kedar shall be gathered together unto thee, the rams of Nebaioth shall minister unto thee: they shall come up with acceptance on mine altar, and I will glorify the house of my glory. 8 Who are these that fly as a cloud, and as the doves to their windows? 9 Surely the isles shall wait for me, and the ships of Tarshish first, to bring thy sons from far, their silver and their gold with them, unto the name of the Lord thy God, and to the Holy One of Israel, because he hath glorified thee. Isaiah 66 - King James Version (KJV) 1 Thus saith the Lord, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool: where is the house that ye build unto me? and where is the place of my rest? 2 For all those things hath mine hand made, and all those things have been, saith the Lord: but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word. 3 He that killeth an ox is as if he slew a man; he that sacrificeth a lamb, as if he cut off a dog's neck; he that offereth an oblation, as if he offered swine's blood; he that burneth incense, as if he blessed an idol. Yea, they have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations. 4 I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not. 5 Hear the word of the Lord, ye that tremble at his word; Your brethren that hated you, that cast you out for my name's sake, said, Let the Lord be glorified: but he shall appear to your joy, and they shall be ashamed. 6 A voice of noise from the city, a voice from the temple, a voice of the Lord that rendereth recompence to his enemies. 7 Before she travailed, she brought forth; before her pain came, she was delivered of a man child. 8 Who hath heard such a thing? who hath seen such things? Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? or shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children. 9 Shall I bring to the birth, and not cause to bring forth? saith the Lord: shall I cause to bring forth, and shut the womb? saith thy God. 10 Rejoice ye with Jerusalem, and be glad with her, all ye that love her: rejoice for joy with her, all ye that mourn for her: 11 That ye may suck, and be satisfied with the breasts of her consolations; that ye may milk out, and be delighted with the abundance of her glory. 12 For thus saith the Lord, Behold, I will extend peace to her like a river, and the glory of the Gentiles like a flowing stream: then shall ye suck, ye shall be borne upon her sides, and be dandled upon her knees. 13 As one whom his mother comforteth, so will I comfort you; and ye shall be comforted in Jerusalem. 14 And when ye see this, your heart shall rejoice, and your bones shall flourish like an herb: and the hand of the Lord shall be known toward his servants, and his indignation toward his enemies. 15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire. 16 For by fire and by his sword will the Lord plead with all flesh: and the slain of the Lord shall be many. 17 They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the Lord. 18 For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory. 19 And I will set a sign among them, and I will send those that escape of them unto the nations, to Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, that draw the bow, to Tubal, and Javan, to the isles afar off, that have not heard my fame, neither have seen my glory; and they shall declare my glory among the Gentiles. 20 And they shall bring all your brethren for an offering unto the Lord out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, saith the Lord, as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the Lord. 21 And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, saith the Lord. 22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain. 23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord. 24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh. Jeremiah 31:21-23 -King James Version (KJV) 21 Set thee up waymarks, make thee high heaps: set thine heart toward the highway, even the way which thou wentest: turn again, O virgin of Israel, turn again to these thy cities. 22 How long wilt thou go about, O thou backsliding daughter? for the Lord hath created a new thing in the earth, A woman shall compass a man. 23 Thus saith the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel; As yet they shall use this speech in the land of Judah and in the cities thereof, when I shall bring again their captivity; The Lord bless thee, O habitation of justice, and mountain of holiness. TBC John 1:17-19 - King James Version (KJV) 17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ. 18 No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. 19 And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou? TBC Last edited by shiloh on Sat May 17, 2014 5:14 am; edited 7 times in total orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 Thank-you Shiloh. This is what I like about posting on this site -- the interesting participants and posts. I wouldn't have encountered this on a Christian site -- I don't think. It forces me to dig deeper -- in unconventional ways. I'm really tired right now -- so I'll need to study your post later today, Shiloh. I continue to wonder about the true identity and nature of the God of This World. Is Mammon the Ruler of Earth?? Is Mammon the Devil's Son?? I've become suspicious regarding male and female identifications regarding the Angelic and Demonic realms. I'm presently thinking in terms of two primary archangels in conflict with each other over Earth and Humanity. I've been wondering if both of these archangels are sometimes called 'Lucifer' or 'Satan'?? I've been wondering if both of these archangels have a good-side and a bad-side?? I've recently been modeling a solar system which is anything but idealistic and sanitized. I've also been suspecting that the madness might extend far beyond this little solar system. Once again -- don't expect a regime-change to necessarily make things better -- at least at this particular point in time. Once again -- take a closer look at the relationship between Judgment -- Predestination -- and Prophecy. What if most of us have been prisoners on a prison-planet in rebellion -- for many thousands of years -- serving a sentence for unspeakable ancient crimes against who knows who?? Once again -- I am suggesting that we consider as many possibilities as possible when thinking about antiquity and the otherworldly -- regardless of whether we like it, or not. The fact that I model dark possibilities does not necessarily make me a dark-soul. Just the opposite. It probably takes a light-soul to do this sort of thing in a neutral and detached manner. Please notice that I try to approximate what the truth MIGHT be -- rather than just glorifying the creepy and the sensational. This is a very strange way of doing theology -- which might actually be closer to the truth than most seminaries!! This isn't for everyone! Don't try this at home, kiddies!! What if Mammon is the Rich Young Ruler -- or the Prodigal Son?? Who knows?? What if it takes an Evil-Deity to rule an Evil-World?? What if a Righteous-Deity wouldn't be capable of ruling Planet Earth (without blowing everyone and everything all the way to hell)?? What if an Evil-Deity is currently being demoted -- with an Intermediate-Deity (aka Interim-Administrator?) temporarily running Earth (for 120 years?) -- to properly prepare this God-Forsaken Planet for a Truly Righteous and Loving Deity in 2133 AD (at the consummation of the 2300 days-years (of Daniel 8:14) inaugurated in 168 BC) at which time the Sanctuary (this solar system?) will have been completely cleansed by virtue of Investigative and Executive Judgments?? What if Mammon is the Nasty Little-Horn??!! What if Mammon has an office at Goldman Sachs??!! Damned if I know... "Don't Follow the Money...You Have No Idea Who and What You're Dealing With..." Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 3:16 pm; edited 3 times in total magamud Posts : 1280 Join date : 2012-06-17 orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 Thank-you magamud. I wonder if there are those who create real monsters and aliens -- right within this solar system?! I wonder about aliens and monsters who might live within this solar system -- who might've been here before any humans (native or alien)?! The hardest part of serious wondering (for me) is not knowing. On the other hand, I suspect that knowing would make things so much worse for me. Should I retain innocent-idealism -- or should I become a nasty, greedy, brutal-bastard?! Should I strive to become an Intergalactic-Banker and Star-Warrior in my next incarnation?? Blessed are the Bad@ System-Lords?? Are the King David, King Solomon, and the Queen of Sheba models more realistic than the Jesus model -- regarding how to change the world (for better or worse) historically and/or in modernity?? Should the Jesus story be studied from the context of King David, King Solomon, and the Queen of Sheba?? Again, not knowing what really occurred historically -- and not knowing what's really going on presently -- are the most difficult parts of attempting to reasonably and rationally deal with the madness. Here is an interesting chapter (pages 61-74) from Prophets and Kings by Ellen White. Again, I have a love/hate relationship with Ellen White. Notice the paragraph in bold-print where mammon is referred to as "The God of This World". Is Ellen White telling us something important, without telling us much?? Is there a double or triple meaning here?? Is Mammon the God of This World?? Is Mammon really Solomon?? If so, then what might that make Solomon's father and/or mother?? What are the exoteric and esoteric identities and meanings connected with King David, King Solomon, and the Queen of Sheba?? Father -- Son -- and Holy Spirit??

Prominent among the primary causes that led Solomon into extravagance and oppression was his failure to maintain and foster the spirit of self-sacrifice.

When, at the foot of Sinai, Moses told the people of the divine command, "Let them make Me a sanctuary; that I may dwell among them," the response of the Israelites was accompanied by the appropriate gifts. "They came, everyone whose heart stirred him up, and everyone whom his spirit made willing," and brought offerings. Exodus 25:8; 35:21. For the building of the sanctuary, great and extensive preparations were necessary; a large amount of the most precious and costly material was required, but the Lord accepted only freewill offerings. "Of every man that giveth it willingly with his heart ye shall take My offering," was the command repeated by Moses to the congregation. Exodus 25:2. Devotion to God and a spirit of sacrifice were the first requisites in preparing a dwelling place for the Most High.

A similar call to self-sacrifice was made when David turned over to Solomon the responsibility of building the temple. Of the assembled multitude David asked, "Who then is willing to consecrate his service this day unto the Lord?" 1 Chronicles 29:5. This call to consecration and willing service should ever have been kept in mind by those who had to do with the erection of the temple.

For the construction of the wilderness tabernacle, chosen men were endowed by God with special skill and wisdom. "Moses said unto the children of Israel, See, the Lord hath called by name Bezaleel, . . . of the tribe of Judah; and He hath filled him with the Spirit of God, in wisdom, in understanding, and in knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship. . . . And He hath put in his heart that he may teach, both he, and Aholiab, . . . of the tribe of Dan. Them hath He filled with wisdom of heart, to work all manner of work, of the engraver, and of the cunning workman, and of the embroiderer, . . . and of the weaver, even of them that do any work. . . . Then wrought Bezaleel and Aholiab, and every wisehearted man, in whom the Lord put wisdom and understanding." Exodus 35:30-35; 36:1. Heavenly intelligences co-operated with the workmen whom God Himself had chosen.

The descendants of these workmen inherited to a large degree the talents conferred on their forefathers. For a time these men of Judah and Dan remained humble and unselfish; but gradually, almost imperceptibly, they lost their hold upon God and their desire to serve Him unselfishly. They asked higher wages for their services, because of their superior skill as workmen in the finer arts. In some instances their request was granted, but more often they found employment in the surrounding nations. In place of the noble spirit of self-sacrifice that had filled the hearts of their illustrious ancestors, they indulged a spirit of covetousness, of grasping for more and more. That their selfish desires might be gratified, they used their God-given skill in the service of heathen kings, and lent their talent to the perfecting of works which were a dishonor to their Maker.

It was among these men that Solomon looked for a master workman to superintend the construction of the temple on Mount Moriah. Minute specifications, in writing, regarding every portion of the sacred structure, had been entrusted to the king; and he could have looked to God in faith for consecrated helpers, to whom would have been granted special skill for doing with exactness the work required. But Solomon lost sight of this opportunity to exercise faith in God. He sent to the king of Tyre for a man, "cunning to work in gold, and in silver, and in brass, and in iron, and in purple, and crimson, and blue, and that can skill to grave with the cunning men . . . in Judah and in Jerusalem." 2 Chronicles 2:7

The Phoenician king responded by sending Huram, "the son of a woman of the daughters of Dan, and his father was a man of Tyre." Verse 14. Huram was a descendant, on his mother's side, of Aholiab, to whom, hundreds of years before, God had given special wisdom for the construction of the tabernacle.

Thus at the head of Solomon's company of workmen there was placed a man whose efforts were not prompted by an unselfish desire to render service to God. He served the god of this world, mammon. The very fibers of his being were inwrought with the principles of selfishness.

Because of his unusual skill, Huram demanded large wages. Gradually the wrong principles that he cherished came to be accepted by his associates. As they labored with him day after day, they yielded to the inclination to compare his wages with their own, and they began to lose sight of the holy character of their work. The spirit of self-denial left them, and in its place came the spirit of covetousness. The result was a demand for higher wages, which was granted.

The baleful influences thus set in operation permeated all branches of the Lord's service, and extended throughout the kingdom. The high wages demanded and received gave to many an opportunity to indulge in luxury and extravagance. The poor were oppressed by the rich; the spirit of self-sacrifice was well-nigh lost. In the far-reaching effects of these influences may be traced one of the principal causes of the terrible apostasy of him who once was numbered among the wisest of mortals.

The sharp contrast between the spirit and motives of the people building the wilderness tabernacle, and of those engaged in erecting Solomon's temple, has a lesson of deep significance. The self-seeking that characterized the workers on the temple finds its counterpart today in the selfishness that rules in the world. The spirit of covetousness, of seeking for the highest position and the highest wage, is rife.

The willing service and joyous self-denial of the tabernacle workers is seldom met with. But this is the only spirit that should actuate the followers of Jesus. Our divine Master has given an example of how His disciples are to work. To those whom He bade, "Follow Me, and I will make you fishers of men" (Matthew 4:19), He offered no stated sum as a reward for their services. They were to share with Him in self-denial and sacrifice.

Not for the wages we receive are we to labor. The motive that prompts us to work for God should have in it nothing akin to self-serving. Unselfish devotion and a spirit of sacrifice have always been and always will be the first requisite of acceptable service. Our Lord and Master designs that not one thread of selfishness shall be woven into His work. Into our efforts we are to bring the tact and skill, the exactitude and wisdom, that the God of perfection required of the builders of the earthly tabernacle; yet in all our labors we are to remember that the greatest talents or the most splendid services are acceptable only when self is laid upon the altar, a living, consuming sacrifice.

Another of the deviations from right principles that finally led to the downfall of Israel's king was his yielding to the temptation to take to himself the glory that belongs to God alone.

From the day that Solomon was entrusted with the work of building the temple, to the time of its completion, his avowed purpose was "to build an house for the name of the Lord God of Israel." 2 Chronicles 6:7. This purpose was fully recognized before the assembled hosts of Israel at the time of the dedication of the temple. In his prayer the king acknowledged that Jehovah had said, "My name shall be there." 1 Kings 8:29.

One of the most touching portions of Solomon's dedicatory prayer was his plea to God for the strangers that should come from countries afar to learn more of Him whose fame had been spread abroad among the nations. "They shall hear," the king pleaded, "of Thy great name, and of Thy strong hand, and of Thy stretched-out arm." In behalf of every one of these stranger worshipers Solomon had petitioned: "Hear Thou, . . . and do according to all that the stranger calleth to Thee for: that all people of the earth may know Thy name, to fear Thee, as do Thy people Israel; and that they may know that this house, which I have builded, is called by Thy name." Verses 42, 43.

At the close of the service, Solomon had exhorted Israel to be faithful and true to God, in order that "all the people of the earth may know," he said, "that the Lord is God, and that there is none else." Verse 60.

A Greater than Solomon was the designer of the temple; the wisdom and glory of God stood there revealed. Those who were unacquainted with this fact naturally admired and praised Solomon as the architect and builder; but the king disclaimed any honor for its conception or erection.

Thus it was when the Queen of Sheba came to visit Solomon. Hearing of his wisdom and of the magnificent temple he had built, she determined "to prove him with hard questions" and to see for herself his famous works. Attended by a retinue of servants, and with camels bearing "spices, and gold in abundance, and precious stones," she made the long journey to Jerusalem. "And when she was come to Solomon, she communed with him of all that was in her heart." She talked with him of the mysteries of nature; and Solomon taught her of the God of nature, the great Creator, who dwells in the highest heaven and rules over all. "Solomon told her all her questions: there was not anything hid from the king, which he told her not." 1 Kings 10:1-3;2 Chronicles 9:1, 2.

"When the Queen of Sheba had seen all Solomon's wisdom, and the house that he had built, . . . there was no more spirit in her." "It was a true report," she acknowledged, "which I heard in mine own land of thine acts, and of thy wisdom: howbeit I believed not their words, until I came, and mine eyes had seen it:" "and, behold, the half was not told me: thy wisdom and prosperity exceedeth the fame which I heard. Happy are thy men, happy are these thy servants, which stand continually before thee, and that hear thy wisdom." 1 Kings 10:4-8; 2 Chronicles 9:3-6.

By the time of the close of her visit the queen had been so fully taught by Solomon as to the source of his wisdom and prosperity that she was constrained, not to extol the human agent, but to exclaim, "Blessed be the Lord thy God, which delighted in thee, to set thee on the throne of Israel: because the Lord loved Israel forever, therefore made He thee king, to do judgment and justice." 1 Kings 10:9. This is the impression that God designed should be made upon all peoples. And when "all the kings of the earth sought the presence of Solomon, to hear his wisdom, that God had put in his heart" (2 Chronicles 9:23), Solomon for a time honored God by reverently pointing them to the Creator of the heavens and the earth, the Ruler of the universe, the All-wise.

Had Solomon continued in humility of mind to turn the attention of men from himself to the One who had given him wisdom and riches and honor, what a history might have been his! But while the pen of inspiration records his virtues, it also bears faithful witness to his downfall. Raised to pinnacle of greatness and surrounded with the gifts of fortune, Solomon became dizzy, lost his balance, and fell. Constantly extolled by men of the world, he was at length unable to withstand the flattery offered him. The wisdom entrusted to him that he might glorify the Giver, filled him with pride. He finally permitted men to speak of him as the one most worthy of praise for the matchless splendor of the building planned and erected for the honor of "the name of the Lord God of Israel."

Thus it was that the temple of Jehovah came to be known throughout the nations as "Solomon's temple." The human agent had taken to himself the glory that belonged to the One "higher than the highest." Ecclesiastes 5:8. Even to this day the temple of which Solomon declared, "This house which I have built is called by Thy name" (2 Chronicles 6:33), is oftenest spoken of, not as the temple of Jehovah, but as "Solomon's temple."

Man cannot show greater weakness than by allowing men to ascribe to him the honor for gifts that are Heaven-bestowed. The true Christian will make God first and last and best in everything. No ambitious motives will chill his love for God; steadily, perseveringly, will he cause honor to redound to his heavenly Father. It is when we are faithful in exalting the name of God that our impulses are under divine supervision, and we are enabled to develop spiritual and intellectual power.

Jesus, the divine Master, ever exalted the name of His heavenly Father. He taught His disciples to pray, "Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy name." Matthew 6:9, A.R.V. And they were not to forget to acknowledge, "Thine is . . . the glory." Verse 13. So careful was the great Healer to direct attention from Himself to the Source of His power, that the wondering multitude, "when they saw the dumb to speak, the maimed to be whole, the lame to walk, and the blind to see," did not glorify Him, but "glorified the God of Israel." Matthew 15:31. In the wonderful prayer that Christ offered just before His crucifixion, He declared, "I have glorified Thee on the earth." "Glorify Thy Son," He pleaded, "that Thy Son also may glorify Thee." "O righteous Father, the world hath not known Thee: but I have known Thee, and these have known that Thou hast sent Me. And I have declared unto them Thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith Thou hast loved Me may be in them, and I in them." John 17:1, 4, 25, 26.

"Thus saith the Lord, Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, let not the rich man glory in his riches: but let him that glorieth glory in this, that he understandeth and knoweth Me, that I am the Lord which exercise loving-kindness, judgment, and righteousness, in the earth: for in these things I delight, saith the Lord." Jeremiah 9:23, 24.

"I will praise the name of God, . . .
And will magnify Him with thanksgiving."

"Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honor
and power."

"I will praise Thee, O Lord my God, with all my heart:
And I will glorify Thy name forevermore."

"O magnify the Lord with me,
And let us exalt His name together."
Psalm 69:30; Revelation 4:11; Psalms 86:12; 34:3.

The introduction of principles leading away from a spirit of sacrifice and tending toward self-glorification, was accompanied by yet another gross perversion of the divine plan for Israel. God had designed that His people should be the light of the world. From them was to shine forth the glory of His law as revealed in the life practice. For the carrying out of this design, He had caused the chosen nation to occupy a strategic position among the nations of earth.

In the days of Solomon the kingdom of Israel extended from Hamath on the north to Egypt on the south, and from the Mediterranean Sea to the river Euphrates. Through this territory ran many natural highways of the world's commerce, and caravans from distant lands were constantly passing to and fro. Thus there was given to Solomon and his people opportunity to reveal to men of all nations the character of the King of kings, and to teach them to reverence and obey Him. To all the world this knowledge was to be given. Through the teaching of the sacrificial offerings, Christ was to be uplifted before the nations, that all who would might live.

Placed at the head of a nation that had been set as a beacon light to the surrounding nations, Solomon should have used his God-given wisdom and power of influence in organizing and directing a great movement for the enlightenment of those who were ignorant of God and His truth. Thus multitudes would have been won to allegiance to the divine precepts, Israel would have been shielded from the evils practiced by the heathen, and the Lord of glory would have been greatly honored. But Solomon lost sight of this high purpose. He failed of improving his splendid opportunities for enlightening those who were continually passing through his territory or tarrying at the principal cities.

The missionary spirit that God had implanted in the heart of Solomon and in the hearts of all true Israelites was supplanted by a spirit of commercialism. The opportunities afforded by contact with many nations were used for personal aggrandizement. Solomon sought to strengthen his position politically by building fortified cities at the gateways of commerce. He rebuilt Gezer, near Joppa, lying along the road between Egypt and Syria; Beth-horon, to the westward of Jerusalem, commanding the passes of the highway leading from the heart of Judea to Gezer and the seacoast; Megiddo, situated on the caravan road from Damascus to Egypt, and from Jerusalem to the northward; and "Tadmor in the wilderness" (2 Chronicles 8:4), along the route of caravans from the east. All these cities were strongly fortified. The commercial advantages of an outlet at the head of the Red Sea were developed by the construction of "a navy of ships in Ezion-geber, . . . on the shore of the Red Sea, in the land of Edom." Trained sailors from Tyre, "with the servants of Solomon," manned these vessels on voyages "to Ophir, and fetched from thence gold," and "great plenty of almug trees, and precious stones." Verse 18; 1 Kings 9:26, 28; 10:11.

The revenue of the king and of many of his subjects was greatly increased, but at what a cost! Through the cupidity and shortsightedness of those to whom had been entrusted the oracles of God, the countless multitudes who thronged the highways of travel were allowed to remain in ignorance of Jehovah.

In striking contrast to the course pursued by Solomon was the course followed by Christ when He was on this earth. The Saviour, though possessing "all power," never used this power for self-aggrandizement. No dream of earthly conquest, of worldly greatness, marred the perfection of His service for mankind. "Foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests," He said, "but the Son of man hath not where to lay His head." Matthew 8:20. Those who, in response to the call of the hour, have entered the service of the Master Worker, may well study His methods. He took advantage of the opportunities to be found along the great thoroughfares of travel.

In the intervals of His journeys to and fro, Jesus dwelt at Capernaum, which came to be known as "His own city." Matthew 9:1. Situated on the highway from Damascus to Jerusalem and Egypt and to the Mediterranean Sea, it was well adapted to be the center of the Saviour's work. People from many lands passed through the city or tarried for rest. There Jesus met with those of all nations and all ranks, and thus His lessons were carried to other countries and into many households. By this means interest was aroused in the prophecies pointing forward to the Messiah, attention was directed to the Saviour, and His mission was brought before the world.

In this our day the opportunities for coming into contact with men and women of all classes and many nationalities are much greater than in the days of Israel. The thoroughfares of travel have multiplied a thousandfold.

Like Christ, the messengers of the Most High today should take their position in these great thoroughfares, where they can meet the passing multitudes from all parts of the world. Like Him, hiding self in God, they are to sow the gospel seed, presenting before others the precious truths of Holy Scripture that will take deep root in mind and heart, and spring up unto life eternal.

Solemn are the lessons of Israel's failure during the years when ruler and people turned from the high purpose they had been called to fulfill. Wherein they were weak, even to the point of failure, the Israel of God today, the representatives of heaven that make up the true church of Christ, must be strong; for upon them devolves the task of finishing the work that has been committed to man, and of ushering in the day of final awards. Yet the same influences that prevailed against Israel in the time when Solomon reigned are to be met with still. The forces of the enemy of all righteousness are strongly entrenched; only by the power of God can the victory be gained. The conflict before us calls for the exercise of a spirit of self-denial, for distrust of self and for dependence on God alone, for the wise use of every opportunity for the saving of souls. The Lord's blessing will attend His church as they advance unitedly, revealing to a world lying in the darkness of error the beauty of holiness as manifested in a Christlike spirit of self-sacrifice, in an exaltation of the divine rather than the human, and in loving and untiring service for those so much in need of the blessings of the gospel.

Once again, consider studying the following study-list:

1. Job through John (KJV).
2. Israel and the Nations by F.F. Bruce.
3. Daniel (1978) by Desmond Ford.
4. The Gods of Eden by William Bramley.
5. Exo-Vaticana by Chris Putnam and Thomas Horn.
6. Patriarchs and Prophets by Ellen White.
7. Tempest and Exodus by Ralph Ellis.
8. Prophets and Kings by Ellen White.
9. Solomon: Falcon of Sheba by Ralph Ellis.
10. The Desire of Ages by Ellen White.
11. Jesus: Last of the Pharaohs by Ralph Ellis.
12. The Federalist Papers (with US Constitution).
13. Astronomy, Biology, and Law Textbooks.
14. Sacred Classical Music.
15. Science Fiction.

Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 3:18 pm; edited 1 time in total

magamud

Posts : 1280
Join date : 2012-06-17
I wonder if there are those who create real monsters and aliens -- right within this solar system?
Im sure of it, you just need to look at our scientist.

is not knowing.
This is described well with Jesus and the Pharisees. For your scientific model mind, I would suggest to just rely on pattern recognition. It is all around you.

Should I retain innocent-idealism -- or should I become a nasty, greedy, brutal-bastard?
This has not been my experience at all Ortho. Your still within the deception of light. Perhaps a bit more open mindedness with your certainty of conclusion.

Are the King David, King Solomon, and the Queen of Sheba models more realistic than the Jesus model
Let me help, God, the Father, uses his Son to ground his power on our earthy dimension. The Holy spirit is connected to both of them. This is because there is One way. This one way creates a crossroads. People think this is authoritarian, but in reality its simplicity and grace. This is a result of the lack of knowledge with both Gods plan and how the Devil works. I will continue to contrast the Devil and Gods mind as best I can praying the holy spirit works with you.

God created the world, warned us of the devil in sending us his Son, prophets down the timeline, and the book. No one when they pass on will get to claim victim with missing the Road. This brings about much guilt in the etherial and people can get more vindictive, procrastinate or prepare to try again when the planets align. All in all, when people mention "eternity" they were not joking.

Is Mammon the God of This World?
This is the Devils world and he has a legion that manage it Again use pattern recognition from our world. Look how evil and good work. They have the same dynamics, just use your logic and witness its evolution.

Sanicle

Posts : 1829
Join date : 2011-02-28
Location : Melbourne, Australia
Good Grief.......why do so many humans believe they KNOW God's mind and have the right to speak for Him? At least Oxy has the humility and intelligence to give God the honor of realizing His Creation is multi-faceted and that our insignificant little minds probably don't (can't?) understand all the ins and outs of His Being and Plan, seeing the dualities, paradoxes and this and that and everything else that is expressed in it. But he does persevere nevertheless, bless him.

orthodoxymoron

Posts : 7483
Join date : 2010-09-28
Thank-you Sanicle. What you said is probably one of the major reasons I stopped going to church -- and why I started listening to talk-radio -- and finally spending (wasting??) a lot of time on websites such as this one. I sort of understand Dogmatic-Theology in the context of HUGE Religions such as Roman Catholicism -- where continuity and unity are deemed highly important and desirable. I get that -- yet truth should be actively pursued in a balanced, reasonable, rational, and evolutionary manner. Sometimes, I think the Latin Mass is sort of cool, because it doesn't subject one to strutting and shouting egomaniacs -- hard-selling that which packs auditoriums, and keeps the money flowing out of wallets and purses. I once spoke with a beautiful black woman, who attended a Latin Mass at Notre Dame de Paris -- and was impressed with its beauty and universality. I have huge problems with the traditional interpretations of the Mass (Latin or Novus Ordo) -- yet there is something to be said for a common world-wide point of reference. The Mass takes on more validity when the participants actively research theology and sacred classical music. The Mass should not be used to keep the Masses Clueless and Passive. I recently mentioned the motorcycle movie On Any Sunday. My favorite scene shows Roman Catholic (or is he Episcopalian??) Gene Romero ("Burrito") sitting on his motorcycle -- crossing himself -- and then immediately being shown sliding sideways on his flat-track motorcycle at 100 miles per hour!! Start watching at the 26 minute mark! I once heard a senior Roman Catholic priest speak repeatedly regarding the Saturday Sabbath -- during a Mass -- making it crystal-clear that he considered Saturday to be the Sabbath!! I was there!! Still, at this point, I support the concept of services being offered each and every day (especially at the larger churches) -- with no preference being given to a particular day. I'm not rejecting the Sabbath. I am resisting a Final-Jihad over the Sabbath (or any other issue, for that matter). We've been tricked into nasty battles, throughout history. Read the entire book of Deuteronomy -- each and every time you read the Ten-Commandments. What if there is a Pre-Torah version of the Sabbath-Commandment?? Siriusly!!

"Love Wins Only When It Defeats Evil". What if it takes an Evil Good-Guy (or Gal) to defeat an Evil Bad-Guy (or Gal)?? This might seem like a ridiculous question -- but what if (especially on a galactic level) it takes a Really Bad@$$Good-Guy (or Gal) to keep the Universe on the Straight and Narrow?? What if the horrible way this world seems to have been managed has been absolutely necessary under the circumstances?? I just can't stop thinking about King David -- King Solomon -- and the Queen of Sheba -- throughout all time -- and throughout the universe -- as ridiculous as that sounds. What if God has to be a Devil -- at certain times -- and in certain contexts?? Doesn't the Bible reveal a Good-God and a Bad-God -- as blasphemous as that sounds?? I continue to think that most (or all) of us don't have any idea what really is involved in running a universe (or a world). I know I don't -- but just thinking about some of the possibilities has nearly gotten me committed to the Psych-Ward of the Bethesda Naval Hospital. BTW -- can you even begin to imagine a Star-War involving Piloted-Planets Ramming Other Planets??!! How do you think we got the Asteroid-Belt?? It might not be wise for Earth to anger the rest of the universe. Just a Thought. Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 3:22 pm; edited 6 times in total magamud Posts : 1280 Join date : 2012-06-17 orthodoxymoron Posts : 7483 Join date : 2010-09-28 Thank-you magamud. It's interesting that you posted a "Charlie Brown" video! On Any Sunday was produced by Bruce Brown! I once met someone named "Bruce Brown" and I asked them if they were related to the On Any Sunday (and The Endless Summer) "Bruce Brown"?! They smiled, and said "You made my day!" as they walked away!! I let them go -- but I often wish that I hadn't!! Should people be able to race motorcycles on the Sabbath?? Should the Sabbath be a Pain in Uranus?? BTW -- how might one observe the Sabbath on (or within) Uranus (where the Sun don't shine)?! I continue to think that one should "Remember to ALWAYS Have a Sabbath-Attitude" and to "Be of Peace. ALWAYS." What if the Perfect Law of the Lord required one to "Take Time to be Holy" -- for one hour -- each and every day -- as satisfying the Sabbath-Commandment?? Wouldn't that just chap everyone's @$$??!! What if you got paid to go to church every day??!! What if you received \$20 per service or class-session (which could be accepted -- or donated to charity)??!! One could opt-out of participating, if they so chose. What if no one will ever be happy with any idea which isn't their own??!! "We have turned everyone to his (and her) own way!!" "There is a way which seemeth right unto a man (or woman), but the ways thereof be the ways of death!!" Should people be killed and/or damned to hell for failure to properly observe the Sabbath?? Where have I stood regarding the Sabbath -- on a Soul-Basis -- going way, way, way back?? I obsess over "spiritual-things" each and every day -- yet I have a rather quiet job which involves working on the Saturday-Sabbath. Will this cost me my eternal-salvation?? I'm feeling no-love -- and I feel as if the Powers That Be Who I Cannot See have been kicking me when I'm down -- for most of my life -- and I've been down and out for most of my life...

Last edited by orthodoxymoron on Sat Feb 13, 2016 3:25 pm; edited 10 times in total

B.B.Baghor

Posts : 1851
Join date : 2014-01-31
Age : 66
Location : Druid county UK
Without meaning to diminish or devalue all that you intend to share here and publish, orthodoxymoron,
because I see your insistant probing and turning of stones, sometimes the same one, over and over,
I personally feel the amount of text, that you share here, is too much of a good thing, in that it's almost impossible to take it in.

I may be somewhat similar to you, in trying to convey what moves me inside, without always knowing how to succesfully attune to the reader here.
I feel I tend to shut out discussions by my strong statements, leaving the reader a bit dumbfounded sometimes.
You and I may be on both sides of a looking glass, alternating between the "bigmaking" - and the "smallmaking" side.
As a kid would say it.

This similary of our exploring wondering minds, may explain my response to the nature of your posts earlier.
And to sit in my chair of wise woman and give you some advise.
For which you have the complete 100 % right to simply lay that advise aside.
In a way I'm happy to see you did